This happened about a month ago and the NTSB and State Highway Patrol reported the cause yesterday.

http://bismarcktribune.com/articles/200 ... 455418.txt

One of the FBOs fueled his plane with jet A. Big Boo Boo. Good Pilot.

Take off with Jet fuel in a gas powerd plane

Big Boo Boo

Bad pilot

2nd on the bad pilot. I don't trust any FBO monkey to chock the tires, let alone put the right fuel in. Always double check the work of another, you're the PIC! What happened to sampling new fuel with the sight and sniff test?

Question: What if you turned away for a moment and turned around to find the line guy pumping Jet A into your tank? You yell for him to stop immediately, then:

1) Ask him how much went in, and if it's only a small quantity, figure that it will dissolve into the 100LL?

2) Insist that the FBO give you a facility to drain and flush your fuel system?

I dont know if Jet A smells different, but shouldnt you be able to tell the difference by looking?

Jr.CubBuilder wrote:Zane Zane, oh dear, don't be sniffing gas man it kills a lot of brain cells just kidding

Isn't JetA clear? I don't know that you would see much difference in color at the sump unless the majority of the gas was Jet, and it seems to me like the color dye in our 100LL settles anyway. Which one is heavier? If you didn't know any better could there be a half tank of JetA floating on top of your 100LL, or would they mix? I'm thinking they would settle out. I'd make them drain the tanks if someone put Jet A in my plane.

Jet A is basically really high quality diesel, so I'm thinking it would be heavier and settle to the bottom initially if they didn't mix.

I do believe Jet A/kerosene/diesel have a distinct smell.

Jet A is clear and a lot of it can be virtually undetectable. It's possible the good Dr. did sump his fuel and didn't find anything unusual. It does smell different, but mix only a little gas and you smell the gas.
I'm guilty of not sumping freshly pumped fuel because, I sump for the water and if it has just been pumped, it hasn't settled out.
You must drain the fuel even if only a little Jet is in there. The reason is that Jet fuel seriously lowers the octane and can cause extensive damage due to detonation.
Your best bet is to be there and ensure the right fuel is dispensed.

Jet A is kerosene based and not really the same as #2 diesel (summer diesel) #1 diesel (winter diesel) is kerosene based and almost the same as Jet A. Either way it does smell different and is a little oily to the touch. The biggest difference is that AV gas evaporates quickly and leaves almost no residue. Jet A is oily and very slow to evaporate.

And, Jet A mixes VERY nicely with avgas. In fact, they call that Jet B, which contains some avgas to lower the viscosity.

It would be really hard to detect SOME Jet A in the tanks of an airplane. And, SOME is all it would take.

Zane, if you ever find that an FBO has pumped ANY amount of Jet fuel into your gas burner, ask them to drain ALL the fuel from your airplane, and replace it with nice fresh avgas. Free of charge, of course. If they refuse, find an attorney, but DON'T fly the thing.

MTV

Remember the test question. If you mix 100LL which is Blue with a different grade or type of fuel, what happens? Answer...Turns clear.

I use 87 mogas which is green. If I am running 100 LL and switch back to the mogas. It does change to clear.

I'll bet the pilot won't make that mistake again.

Also, just because the pump says 100 LL is no guarantee. I used to drive a fuel truck and mistakes have happened. Cheers...Rob

RobBurson wrote:Remember the test question. If you mix 100LL which is Blue with a different grade or type of fuel, what happens? Answer...Turns clear.

I use 87 mogas which is green. If I am running 100 LL and switch back to the mogas. It does change to clear.

When I have 100LL and premium mogas (yellow), the mixture is green. Always reminds me of this toilet bowl cleaner my Mom used that was blue. My brothers and I used to laugh at how yellow + blue = green.

tom

Savannah-Tom wrote:

RobBurson wrote:Remember the test question. If you mix 100LL which is Blue with a different grade or type of fuel, what happens? Answer...Turns clear.

I use 87 mogas which is green. If I am running 100 LL and switch back to the mogas. It does change to clear.

When I have 100LL and premium mogas (yellow), the mixture is green. Always reminds me of this toilet bowl cleaner my Mom used that was blue. My brothers and I used to laugh at how yellow + blue = green.

tom

Tom, interesting how things are different from one area to another. I'm up north of you in the Portland area and I run 92 mogas in my other vehicles. Up here 92 is the same color as 87. Just weird.

Kind of makes since what the oil companies say. We have to make different blends for different areas so it cost more.

Cheers...Rob

http://flighttraining.aopa.org/members/ ... es/891.cfm
The test in the fourth paragraph is a good one. IIRC it can detect 5% contamination. Try a mixture of 100LL and Jet-A and you will see the rings. Notebook paper works great. - Mike

I would agree that all those tests work. Point is, how many pilots carry along a piece of notebook paper, and do that test? Unless, of course, you're suspicious.

There is a concept in law call due diligence. Fuelers are supposed to read the PLACARDS required to be adjacent to the fuel fillers, which specify fuel type.

Pilots are also expected to make an effort to verify fuel quantity and grade.

In certain light, it can be VERY difficult to see ANY blue color even in the best of 100LL, and frankly, IF he did sump the tanks, it may have been difficult to SEE the difference.

In fact, a better quick test is to smell it, as Zane is apparently big into. Jet fuel has a very strong kerosine odor, which is probably easier to detect than the color, at least in some lighting.

My bet is that he didn't take fuel samples after refueling.

Have I ever gone flying after fueling without taking a fuel sample?? Absolutely, and I might do it again sometime.

Cut the guy some slack. He wrecked one of the most beautiful twin engine airplanes ever built, he didn't get hurt, and he didn't hurt anyone else. Presumably, he was insured, but I'm betting he's beating himself up big time over this, with or without good reason, so he probably doesn't need my help.

Personally, I think he did a hell of a job getting the thing on the ground in a field as opposed to T-Boning a house/car/kid in a stroller, etc. Give him some credit for good airmanship, even if his pre-flight skills may have been a bit lax.

MTV

I agree that this guy did a great job getting the plane down without hurting anyone.

What do you do if you don't have those sump thingies
Jon

whee wrote:I agree that this guy did a great job getting the plane down without hurting anyone.

What do you do if you don't have those sump thingies
Jon

Ditto. RB

We had our Baron filled with jet A once back in 1998.

Didn't have any problem seeing the fuel was clear, not blue. Those little cigar shaped tubes are hard to see but the cup type is very easy.

No slack cut here, I bet the fuel receipt even says Jet A. Ours did, I never trust the fuel guy.

The Scout has never found a line guy that can read (fill last 12 gals very slowly)

They all say yep its topped off.

Sometimes I walked them out and have them look.

Mostly I just stand there and explain it.

The pilot claims he checked the fuel and said it was blue. He said he had half avgas and half jet fuel in the plane. Is it possible that the two fuels didn't have enough time to mix?

http://www.kxmc.com/video.asp?ArticleId ... eoId=13094

I'm telling you guy's it's possible although I can't explain it. It has happened more often than you might think. It's most often the big twins because the line guy's are used to an airplane that big taking Jet fuel. They try to put Avgas in the turbine Thrushes I fly pretty often. I assume the jet fuel initially sits on top of the avgas or something.
Rob, what's a sump thingy?

I pumped gas for 6 years while I learned to fly. I ALWAYS pump my own fuel now. Check for color and grade AND always look down the inside of the nozzle for dirt before pumping. Most nozzles are on the outside of the truck and are uncapped and unprotected.

I stand there and watch the lineman fill my plane every time. They always want to grab a hold of the vent tube on the gas cap to get more leverage to loosen the cap. If they were to twist that tube off I'd be stuck...and they would have to replace a $95 gas cap.

what's a sump thingy?

The port on the tanks where you test the fuel is what I meant. I don't have them...only a glass gascolator.

Jon