The local pilot association is starting to plan for the fly-in this June and the question came up about fly-in games i.e. flour bombing.
Would anyone have a recommendation for a flour-bomb drop altitude? A spot landing contest might be possible if there are enough volunteers.

Any other ideas would be appreciated and I'll pass on any info at the next meeting.

I've been involved in several flour bombing games. 50' AGL works pretty well. Much above that, and the safest place to be on the ground is in the target. Much lower becomes unsafe.

Spot landing contests are fun. When we did them in Laramie some years ago, our rules were that landing short was disqualifying, and the closest on or after was the winner who had to buy the beer later. We used a flour line drawn across the runway at about the 1500' mark on a 7700' runway, so that misjudging short wouldn't be unsafe. Once power was reduced, it couldn't be added in again, or that was disqualifying. However, flaps could be extended or retracted as necessary.

Cary

The flying club that I belonged to as a student pilot had a yearly fun day with spot landing, flour bomb and balloon burst set up the way Cary described. Our runway was 2400' with no obstructions on either end. They didn't allow students to participate in any of the contests. I pleaded my case and they allowed students to do the spot landing, lots of fun. Most of my solo student flying was practicing landings at a field my ultralight friends used that was less than 1/2 the length of the club strip.

Thanks, Cary.

deckofficer, What's the balloon burst?

ExperimentalAviator wrote:Thanks, Cary.

deckofficer, What's the balloon burst?

I wasn't allowed to compete but a number of balloons were released and whoever popped the most with their props on two passes won. I can't remember the number of balloons released per contestant, AGL, or any of the rules.

Well, I've been told that flower bombing might happen, per enough volunteers, but not likely with a 50ft AGL drop altitude. As anything below 500ft AGL is a technical vitiation of FAR's outside of takeoff or landing. (This was from a conversation with someone I know from the airport, not a meeting)

It's a county owned airport, if that makes a difference.

ExperimentalAviator wrote:Well, I've been told that flower bombing might happen, per enough volunteers, but not likely with a 50ft AGL drop altitude. As anything below 500ft AGL is a technical vitiation of FAR's outside of takeoff or landing. (This was from a conversation with someone I know from the airport, not a meeting)

It's a county owned airport, if that makes a difference.

Well then, have them drop it at 50agl before landing.

ExperimentalAviator wrote:Well, I've been told that flower bombing might happen, per enough volunteers, but not likely with a 50ft AGL drop altitude. As anything below 500ft AGL is a technical vitiation of FAR's outside of takeoff or landing. (This was from a conversation with someone I know from the airport, not a meeting)

It's a county owned airport, if that makes a difference.

That may not be correct, but like most things FAA-related it depends on the context.

91.119 Minimum safe altitudes; general
Except when necessary for takeoff or landing, no person may operate an aircraft below the
following altitudes:
(a) Anywhere – An altitude allowing, if a power unit fails, an emergency landing without
undue hazard to persons or property on the surface.
(b) Over congested areas – Over any congested area of a city, town, or settlement, or over
any open-air assembly of persons, an altitude of 1,000 feet above the highest obstacle
within a horizontal radius of 2,000 feet of the aircraft.
(c) Over other than congested areas – An altitude of 500 feet above the surface except over
open water or sparsely populated areas. In that case, the aircraft may not be operated
closer than 500 feet to any person, vessel, vehicle, or structure.

If your flour drop happens in a sparely populated area (i.e. some field with no houses nearby), you can skim the grass as long as you aren't within 500 feet of any person, vessel, vehicle, or structure. If your target is a painted circle on the ground, it should be legal. Now should and can are two different things, and bear in mind the FAA actively encourages people to report unsafe low flying, so choose your drop zone carefully.

If your DZ is actually at the airport somewhere, then you probably need to adhere to the 500' rule. If you can do the drop nearby in a wide open space and keep any ground observers at least 500 feet away from the target and flight path, and ensure nobody violates that FAR, it's probably fine. People fly lower than 500' to the ground all the time, they just don't do it around "any person, vessel, vehicle, or structure".

Rob,
That though crossed my mind.

colopilot,
From what I've got the plan is to have the DZ at the airport. So.. ya.
And thanks for bring up 91.119, the person I was talking to is working on their pilot license and they were saying you can't fly below 500ft, I was saying you could... I was right, you can fly below 500ft.

Cary wrote: 50' AGL works pretty well. Much above that, and the safest place to be on the ground is in the target.
Cary

Now that's funny.

For 32 years they've had a bomb drop and spot landing contest at the annual Piper Cub flyin at Lompoc, CA. They have 50sets of bombs every year and almost always sell out.

Nobody has *ever* put one in the barrel, and that's from 200'. 500' would be borderline impossible.

I'll find out if flour bombing will happen at all at the next meeting which will be sometime this month. I'll post what the ruling is after the meeting.

Check your insurance policy. Some policy's state no coverage if engaged in any race or competition or something like that. I have seen it in some policy's and not in others. Read carefully.


Kurt

PS, did I spell policy's right?

No, it's policies. Thank my 7th grade English teacher, who almost got me to hate poetry, but helped my understanding of grammar, maybe too much!

Cary

Cary wrote:No, it's policies. Thank my 7th grade English teacher, who almost got me to hate poetry, but helped my understanding of grammar, maybe too much!

Cary

Thanks for the correction Cary!

Kurt

G44 wrote:

Cary wrote:No, it's policies. Thank my 7th grade English teacher, who almost got me to hate poetry, but helped my understanding of grammar, maybe too much!

Cary

Thanks for the correction Cary!

Kurt

Nah, thank that ol' biddy that tried to destroy poetry for me.

Cary

Well, Kurt had it right. Do to insurance, no organized/official spot landing or flour bombing contest.

If a contest was organized it would require insurance just for that, from what I got.