https://www.faa.gov/documentLibrary/media/Notice/N_8900.463.pdf

As of yesterday you no longer need to take your commercial pilot checkride in a complex aircraft. This would have saved me a lot of money in rental fees!

As God as my witness, I never thought this would be changed. I can now do my Comm x-ride in the 172!

I would have expected BigRenna to post something like this on 4/1/2XXX, but this is fantastic news!

Rod

This is good and I agree that complex or turbine is not necessary for initial CPL or CFI. I took my CPL flight test in a C-140.

This will have a collateral effect.
If you rent planes then you know that the only plane sitting on the ramp on a sunny Saturday is the sole Arrow or 172RG the FBO has for commercial training.

And as a user you generally find the plane costs the same as a non-derilict 172/PA28 to operate on a per mile basis, and is more enjoyable to fly with new passengers.

That plane is about to get sold.

Aftcg,

Your observation reminds me of the only two trike and radio equipped airplanes at Ag Flight. Billy met the required aircraft for PPL and CPL with a beat up C-150 and a beat up PA-24.

aftCG wrote:This will have a collateral effect.
If you rent planes then you know that the only plane sitting on the ramp on a sunny Saturday is the sole Arrow or 172RG the FBO has for commercial training.

And as a user you generally find the plane costs the same as a non-derilict 172/PA28 to operate on a per mile basis, and is more enjoyable to fly with new passengers.

That plane is about to get sold.

You still need complex time for commercial, just not the checkride, so I think there will still be a demand. For most initial CPL applicants, they'll be doing their commercial maneuvers in a complex plane because they've been flying it to build those 10 hours, so they are most comfortable in it anyway and likely to continue using it for the checkride.

I think this new notice makes sense for CFI applicants, but I also think that commercial applicants should have to take their checkride in a complex. It's a notable skill and 10 hours of complex from 5 years before the checkride doesn't cut it in my opinion. Not that anyone is listening to my opinion, but there it is.

I'm currently training for CFI and my next lesson was switching over to the Arrow to start preparing for the checkride. Now I'm staying in the 172 to save $$$, and I'll be mostly instructing in 172's anyway. The only downside for me is that I wanted that extra complex time and also the arrow is so much easier to schedule...

-asa

Like ASA said, the 10 hours of complex is still required.

However, I disagree that any hours of complex makes much sense, as a prerequisite for the commercial. Any employer is going to require a whole lot more time in its aircraft, as much as for insurance requirements as anything. If the company's aircraft are retracts, then the insurance company will require either 15 or 20 or 25 hours, depending on a number of factors. If the company's aircraft are fixed gear with CS props, then the requirement may be pretty minimal, perhaps a 1 hour checkout in some cases, more in others. By the time a pilot amasses the 500 hours necessary for 135 ops, he/she will have little trouble transitioning to a higher performance complex airplane.

I took my commercial and CFI rides in a 172. Once I started flying charter, that was mostly in 182s, and since I already had plenty of time in them, there was no checkout time at all. The FBO's insurer required 10 hours checkout for the 206 and 25 for the T210. But everything I'd learned in the 172s to get the commercial was absolutely transferable to the other aircraft.

The only "extra" item that I hadn't been made aware of until I took my first 135 ride was the advantage of pulling the prop control all the way out to reduce the drag of the prop disc. That's a story worth repeating, because it was something I'd never been taught.

The Inspector and I had flown for most of the ride, which included some but not all of the commercial maneuvers, in a bone stock 182. That was so long ago that I only remember doing a descending spiral, but I'm sure there were others. Then we headed back and did a normal landing. He wanted to do more pattern work, so we took off again. On downwind, he pulled the power and said to land. I immediately turned toward the runway, and with not a whole lot of room to spare, turned to line up with the runway, dropped the flaps, and landed.

The Inspector said that what I'd done was textbook, but he wanted me to do it again. So we took off, and he said to make the downwind as close as the previous downwind as possible. At just about the same place, he pulled the power again. As I leveled in the short base, he said to pull the prop control all the way out, and the airplane leaped ahead! When I turned to line up with the runway, I had a lot more altitude above it, which made it much easier to configure for landing because I had no concern about making the runway.

That little trick can be a bacon-saver when flying a CS prop if the engine fails.

Cary

While I am glad to see the regulation change it didn't come into play for me. I knew when I was doing my training back then that I was going to do this for a living. When the time came I combined my multi engine training along with the commercial ticket. I did my multi training to commercial standards and rented the 172 one day to practice some maneuvers. This was a recommended path for me to take by my examiner.

So the day of the check ride I flew around on one in the mighty Duchess and did all that went with that. Then I hopped in a 172 and did the goofy air work (8 on pylons, etc) and after about 25 minutes in that airplane I was done. Saved me time and money doing it that way. Would still recommend that approach today.

Did you get multi or single comm privileges. I looked at renting a 310 to do comm because it was the only available aircraft locally, but was told i would only get multi privileges and still would need to find a complex single to get those privileges. I actually purchased a mooney to do comm work in, but due to scheduling and what-not, my partner gear upped the craft before i could do my x-ride. Silver lining is that the insurance money bought my 180. I also abhor the idea of renting an airplane when i have two in the hangar already...

I take Cary's tact on this and if you have been trained and signed off, the insurance company will be the dictator of the additional training requirements.

From what others have said, the comm x-ride is a tighter private ride, with heavy emphasis on the rules and regs ( which it should be ).

This change will benefit me greatly ( monetarily ) and I don't think it will degrade the pool of comm pilots with the change.

R

In my case I got both multi and single commercial ratings that day. When it came time for the ATP I just did multi only.