About a year ago a company called Grypmat reached out to me to test a new product they had... I did, and have come to find it invaluable when working on airplanes. After some testing, I gave my feedback, which surrounded the mat's issues with solvents and static charge. To my astonishment, Tom (creator) listened and reformulated the mat.

Anyway, I just saw they have a Kick Starter campaign going to fund two more sizes. After a year of using this thing, I feel strongly enough about the product that I wanted to support Tom. (I'm not associated other than my review) but FWIW, I've funded $100 to get the two smaller sizes along with another 12x22. If you haven't seen them at Spruce or at OSH, give it a look. Kudos Tom and good luck!

If you want to order a unit, I encourage you to consider funding their Kick Starter rather than ordering from Spruce.

https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/gr ... ube.fnd.to

Hey Bigrenna, I want you to give the Gripmat guy an idea for me. I had been thinking about something similar to this for years. Since he is set up for doing this it will be a natural for him. Tell him to donate a small percentage of his sales to BCP if he uses the idea.

Almost every one of us with an airplane, especially back country airplanes, can use this:

FuelMat : a soft rubberized mat that is shaped to go around and seal the fuel filler neck on airplanes, that allows fuel spillage to run off into a container instead of on top of your wing, windshield, boot cowl, etc. The walls and perimeter of FuelMat keep spills inside the mat, and a ramp or spout is molded into one edge so the spilled fuel can be collected (baby food jar, Jerry Can, etc.) and put back into the tank. This serves two purposes - it keeps gas off your aircraft surface and it prevents spills from leaving unpleasant/toxic/hazard/smelly residue from reaching the ground.

Silicone won't do it because gas will eat it. He needs to locate the right compound, some kind of soft urethane or whatever. The mat has to be lightweight and roll up like he shows in his video. The material has to be stretchy enough to stretch and seal around the gas filler neck.

Anyone who doesn't want blue gas stains on his wing or fuselage will buy this. There may have to be one made for wing leading edges and another made for cowl tanks (Champ, Cub, Taylorcraft).

EZFlap wrote:Tell him to donate a small percentage of his sales to BCP...

I sent him this link... Perhaps he could set up a BCP discount code once his Kickstarter is over. I know that the Greatland Laser guy did when we were talking about his signal laser. Supporting BCP is key!

Be sure to mention that it must be static free..

I was suggesting a full-blown royalty for the idea, which otherwise might have gone to me for having the idea and giving it to him (but I herewith transfer that to BCP as a token of thanks for the work Zane has done and does for the aviation community).

That type of royalty is usually paid as something like $X dollars per unit sold worldwide. It's compensation for the IP behind the product. That has nothing to do with a BCP member discount code.

Because I posted the idea on a public forum this whole idea is now essentially a leap of faith on my part. I'm sure the attorneys would have a field day with it. But if fairness and "good faith" are still in anyone's vocabulary, I personally think that a dollar per unit is completely reasonable as compensation for the idea, and I'm certain that BCP's continued operation and functionality is a very worthwhile recipient for that money. The FuelMat product as envisioned would certainly be worth a $29.95 retail price or maybe a little better. So a buck out of that is not a large or burdensome percentage.

The tooling/molds for it would be just a little bit easier and simpler than his Grypmat product, since there are no dividers and there could be a bit of "draft" angle built into the mold design that the Grypmat does not have. This will allow the FuelMat to stack or nest together for shipping or storage.

Of course it must be static free, or have a static lug that the fuel pump ground cable attaches to. The FuelMat would not ever be anywhere that the aircraft structure is not already. Meaning that you can still touch the fuel nozzle to the metal filler neck... everything I'm talking about is downstream of or below the existing fuel neck.

Hello,
I shot Grypmat an e-mail referencing this thread. I am not fuzzy about kickstarter, guess I am a out of touch old person. I just wanted to order 2 and go about my way.
Anyways hopefully he will see the thread and consider.

I agree RE: Kickstarter. This is the first time I have ever supported anyone on it and dont know much about it. I think he doesn't have any of the molds set up for the smaller ones and is using the platform to get the ball rolling. Hopefully he will chime in...

When I first heard about these last year, I told my wife that was what I wanted for my birthday. She reached out to the creator ,who made his first sale to her through a social media sit that rhymes with "spacecrook". Unfortunately, when the product was finally produced, it was routed through Aircraft Spruce ...and they added an unholy-act-of-a-markup on it, and finally shipped in a long while later. When I received it, I was really stoked, and have used it for all sorts off off-camber and slick-surface endeavors and I really like it!!! But, the financial side was such a screw job that I'll never support Aircraft Spruce again if I can help it. ( I even went a couple rounds of verbal judo with their customer-non-service-rep...)

So, please support this great grypmat at endevor, but do it somehow avoiding those shysters at Spruce.

KW

zenpilot wrote:When I first heard about these last year, I told my wife that was what I wanted for my birthday. She reached out to the creator ,who made his first sale to her through a social media sit that rhymes with "spacecrook". Unfortunately, when the product was finally produced, it was routed through Aircraft Spruce ...and they added an unholy-act-of-a-markup on it, and finally shipped in a long while later. When I received it, I was really stoked, and have used it for all sorts off off-camber and slick-surface endeavors and I really like it!!! But, the financial side was such a screw job that I'll never support Aircraft Spruce again if I can help it. ( I even went a couple rounds of verbal judo with their customer-non-service-rep...)

So, please support this great grypmat at endevor, but do it somehow avoiding those shysters at Spruce.

KW

That's an interesting scenario. Aircraft Spruce has given me nothing but excellent customer service over the years, including returns and refunds. In my opinion, as I understand this, the fault lies in the poor communication about how the fulfillment was to be accomplished.

Hi Karl.

For whatever my opinion is worth, Aircraft Spruce has been absolutely fantastic to deal with, both selling the product that I produce and me buying airplane stuff from them as an airport bum retail customer.

Jim Irwin grew up as an airport kid, he flies, owns airplanes, and has gotten his hands dirty building and fixing stuff. His family flies, his kids fly, and they are being groomed (from sweeping the warehouse all the way up to the executive suite) to continue the business as a third generation family owned business. But Jim's parents ALSO sent him to MBA business school so he knows how to be a "suit" and can swim with any of the sharks in the business world without getting eaten.

That is an unbeatable combination, a loyal and full-blood aviator who is also a sharp edged suit. THAT is why Aircraft Spruce continues to grow and be successful. I'm sure Jim's not perfect and I'm sure he has made decisions or policies that piss certain people off. But overall he's "one of us" who happens to be a corporate big-shot too.

As a manufacturer, what Aircraft spruce does for me, in return for its percentage of sales, is a bargain. They put me in a catalog that is in the hands of 90% of airplane people worldwide, at no cost. They never fail to pay for what they order. They never fail to forward technical question customer inquiries to me, so I can provide accurate information to the customer. They deal with the credit card processing nonsense that I don't want to. Working with ACS has been a huge winner for my small one-man business.

EZFlap wrote:For whatever my opinion is worth...

Thread hijacks suck...

As does misplaced blame....

Why don't we just stick to helping the Grypmat guy develop a BCP relevant product and putting some financial suppport into the coffers for the website, eh?

Back to unhijacking (if there was any hijacking, it seemed minimal to me): I think Kickstarter works in different ways at the discretion of the developer. I have a friend who used it to raise funds for his fabulous popcorn popper, and he chose to honor the contributions by directly sending the poppers to the contributors and collecting the payments himself. It was a pain in the neck. I would think having a catalog vendor handle the funding and shipping would be a lot easier. But obviously, any miscommunication about the pricing should be communicated to the contributors so that they don't feel snockered.

Incidentally, my popcorn popper purchase cost me more than the retail price on Amazon. But it was worth it to support a friend, to get in on the ground floor, and besides, it's a great popper and I like popcorn!

Cary

EZFlap wrote:

I like this idea. But I think I would rather have the spilled fuel drain away from me -- off the back of the wing. Guess I could turn it around.

Biggest cause of fuel spills for me is not being able to see into the tank while I'm doing it. A black rubber mat helps a lot.-- so eyes are not overwhelmed by the white wing and I can see better into the tank.

The grypmat does look mighty cool though.

At a fuel stop not too long ago, I can't now recall where, the rampy had a mat that he laid on the wing that had a hole in it for the fuel port. It didn't have the side dams, because I think it's purpose was to reduce scratching of wings with fuel spouts. I thought it was a nice touch and showed some extra care.

I've spilled fuel a few times when I didn't stop the flow soon enough, but the amount hasn't been enough to stain anything. The worst staining occurred on 3 occasions, one when a crack had developed in the top of one of the aluminum tanks, the second when a crack developed in the top of the other tank, and the third when a gasket for the tank sender of one of the tanks was leaking. Stoddard solvent took the stain right off.

My guess is that if I had a mat like EZ suggests, it would make me more careful, so it would never get "damped". Then the first time that I didn't take the time to get out the mat is when I'd have a real overflow!

Cary

OP offered his recommendation on a current product. I saw it at Airventure, and yes, cool idea. I just don't work on the top of the wing very often.

I will be making myself a pad to put over the lifting eyes on my 185 for when I'm changing from wheels to floats, and back. I want some protection for the paint while connecting and disconnecting the slings.

I also planned on buying a protective mat for fueling to protect against scratches. One with the ability to catch overfills would be especially helpful when fuelling a floatplane at a dock. I've witnessed spills into waterways, and it always causes some guilt.

There's a need for this product, land and sea. I'm not sure that a bit of fuel spilled occasionally is a major environmental concern, but the optics aren't good, and this product would likely catch on.

If I did accidentally hijack the thread I will offer an apology, however that apology is somewhat limited because I saw an opportunity to help the Grypmat guy and support BCP at the same time. Some of the people on these internet forums like to support small business and inventors in aviation, and some others like to take pot shots at them.

As for the post supporting Aircraft Spruce, it came after another message supporting ACS had been posted by someone else. Perhaps we should throw a rope over a tree branch for that guy.

If the Grypmat guy pursues my idea, my guess is that he will make decent money on it and BCP will see a small income stream from it. Throw a rope over the branch for me too, wouldn't be the first time.

this is the crap that causes me not to post on any forum...

Slantbuggy wrote:this is the crap that causes me not to post on any forum...

???

Cary