I just got back from OSH, where I went to a couple of forums on safety and spoke to sellers of safety equipment.

Steve McCaughey, SPA President, said that SAR services in response to a PLB or 406 ELT are provided by AFSRCC or the USCG, and there’s not a charge to the rescued. A talk from a guy who actually takes the calls at AFSRCC said the same thing in stronger terms: “never a fee.” I asked both whether there was a difference between 406 devices and third party actors like SPOT and inReach. That is, if I push the SOS button on one of those devices and some dude who works for their contractor initiates the rescue, what does that cost in time and is it possible I’ll get billed by someone? Steve wasn’t certain. The AFSRCC guy declined to say anything about third party notifications, except to say that the lost time was usually a matter of minutes. He then reiterated that any rescue coordinated by AFSRCC was free of charge to the people being rescued.

Having read on the internet that it’s possible to get billed for a rescue, and knowing from experience that ambulance companies bill hard and are NEVER in network, I took the question to SPOT. Until recently, their calls were coordinated by GEOS, who also sold “rescue insurance,” which was meant to cover the charges incurred in your rescue. “If I push SOS and someone comes to get me, is it possible they’ll send me a bill later?” Their guy said, “well, it’s possible that they might think you called them for some reason that isn’t a real emergency and they might bill you for that.” That sounds like the kind of thing people say about police responses to home security systems, but it’s generally untrue.

So, now I’m bringing the question to the largest group of accident victims I know: BCP!

Have you ever been the beneficiary of a rescue? Have you been billed for it? If so, who coordinated it? Do you know anyone with a believable story about it? Yeah, “I’ve heard” the same stuff everyone else has heard. But what about eyewitness accounts?

Thanks!

The only time I have heard of a bill for a rescue is our local ski resort in Boise. If you go out of bounds and need assistance or get lost, Bogus Basin will bill you $1,000.00 per hour for search and rescue. A newspaper article here a couple of years ago quoted a price of $25,000.00 minimum charge for a helicopter ambulance if you do not have insurance to cover it, but all the insurance companies have a lower "negotiated rate", they didn't say what that rate was.

Just as long as I am not billed for Scrappy's services!!!

I think the comment of coordinating is misleading. They may coordinate rescue, but the agency or private entity that responds may charge for the recovery. Our agency a major west coast department, doesn’t charge for a response to any of the many different beacons. That being said, we often rescue people and hand over patients to for profit providers once we fulfilled the rescue function.

Private companies often charge a premium for their service. I’m sure a lot goes into what they will charge, but it’s a mystery to me.


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Wouldn’t the fee be the exorbitant taxes we all already pay?

In Washington State if you land on a highway and the State Dept of Transportation sends a crew out, or if you are unlucky enough to damage any infrastructure you will get a bill for " costs" that could be eye watering. A few years ago my engine seized at night so I landed on a busy divided highway. There were no charges from either of the LEO departments for the six or seven squad cars that showed up, but the DOT sent three trucks - each with a driver/emergency cleanup guy. I got a bill for about $1050 from the DOT. We did get a tow from where the plane was pulled over to a private airstrip about 3 miles away in the direction my plane was pointed. I guess it was a bit steeper than towing an RV, but ... the plane got a new engine and flew off that private strip about two months later. It's still flying.

propeller26 wrote:I think the comment of coordinating is misleading. They may coordinate rescue, but the agency or private entity that responds may charge for the recovery. Our agency a major west coast department, doesn’t charge for a response to any of the many different beacons. That being said, we often rescue people and hand over patients to for profit providers once we fulfilled the rescue function.

Private companies often charge a premium for their service. I’m sure a lot goes into what they will charge, but it’s a mystery to me.


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So, you’re saying that AFSRCC could call the county sheriff, who then calls St. Avarice Life Flight, who’ll bill me later?

If that’s the case, I wonder what kind of insurance would take care of it. Like I said before, ambulance services are never in network for anyone; their bills are always a burden.

I had a collapse bladder in a 182 that I was not aware of and I ran out of gas several years ago. Landed on I-80 near Wells, NV. Called Auto club got gas and the Highway Patrol let me take off from freeway. No bill. Some explaining to do with the FAA

In Colorado you can help fund SAR and ensure you will never receive a bill by either purchasing a hunting or fishing license or a SAR card, the stand alone card is like $12 for 5 years.

Its rare anywhere in the U.S. to get a bill for SAR services unless there is blatent disregard for rules and good judgement; the example of ducking a rope out of bounds at a ski area is a good example. We had a winter search that resulted in a bill maybe 10 years ago in Durango from just such a situation. The patient never paid.

Around here we may end up using a private medical helicopter to assist in locating a patient. We won't bill for that service and the helicopter here has never billed our team for such a use. As soon as they land and you become a patient you can expect a $30k + bill, they have become an ambulance at that point. You have the right to refuse transport, even if it means the SAR team will have to help you out of the field. SAR is free, medevec costs. Your medical insurance may cover it. We had a skier with a leg injury who refused helicopter transport a few years back, we assisted him out of the field and his friend drove him to the hospital. We all thought he made the right call.

You can also buy supplemental emergency evacuation insurance. Depending on what you pay this could be local, regional, or international.

Be careful about some of the add on evacuation insurance options with SPOT or Inreach/Garmin. Often there is fine print that states the insurance is not valid if you are less than 100 miles from your residence. For those of us that recreate close to home that line would make the insurance pointless.

Internationally in the first world often SAR is not billed. If you need services in other countries other than Canada and Europe you can anticipate needing to wire money or give them a credit card before a search is even initiated.

Here's a little plug: come to Durango and take a WFR in my hangar in September to be prepared for backcountry operations. Info at wildernessmedic.com

Cheers,

Brad

I was in an airplane crash a couple years ago, and was medicvac'd to Harborview Hospital in Seattle-- about a 40 mile flight.
The bill From Airlift Northwest was $20K.
To add insult to injury, the bill for the ambulance that took me from the helipad to the ER (about 100 yards) was another two grand.
Luckily the airplane owner's insurance covered it all.

FWIW Airlift NW has a "membership" program, it's $60 a year for Washington or Alaska residents.
What they don't really advertise is that it only covers your co-pay of what your own insurance doesn't cover.
So if you don't have medivac coverage as part of your health insurance already, you're SOL.
I think other medivac outfits like LifeFlight have similar programs,
but I don't know if they're reciprocal with other outfits.

Both Airlift NW & Life Flight operate here in western WA,
I suspect it's a crap shoot on who will come to get you depending on who's available,
and in extreme cases, who's closest.
So unless the memberships are reciprocal, you just about need a membership with both of them.

Years (decades...) ago, a story went around my hang gliding group of a certain guy who for various reasons had a rescue chopper called for him, by others. HE knew he was all right, and when he spotted the med transport chopper searching the area he was in, cheap b*stard that he was (I'd do the same) he curled up around a big sage brush and didn't get found/billed.

I don't see much point in being concerned about it, other than making darn sure to never get around or near an ambulance or helicopter unless it is a truly life ending deal. I have driven myself twice to the emergency room (construction mishaps) and the attending physicians expressed some amazement I didn't call an ambulance. My biggest fear in landing off airport, in this age of cells phones etc., is some well meaning citizen "calling for help." It'd be a shame to tie up expensive equipment and personal when it wasn't needed, an even bigger shame to be billed for it.

hotrod180 wrote:I was in an airplane crash a couple years ago, and was medicvac'd to Harborview Hospital in Seattle-- about a 40 mile flight.
The bill From Airlift Northwest was $20K.
To add insult to injury, the bill for the ambulance that took me from the helipad to the ER (about 100 yards) was another two grand.
Luckily the airplane owner's insurance covered it all.

FWIW Airlift NW has a "membership" program, it's $60 a year for Washington or Alaska residents.
What they don't really advertise is that it only covers your co-pay of what your own insurance doesn't cover.
So if you don't have medivac coverage as part of your health insurance already, you're SOL.
I think other medivac outfits like LifeFlight have similar programs,
but I don't know if they're reciprocal with other outfits.

Both Airlift NW & Life Flight operate here in western WA,
I suspect it's a crap shoot on who will come to get you depending on who's available,
and in extreme cases, who's closest.
So unless the memberships are reciprocal, you just about need a membership with both of them.

I say straight SAR and medevac are a bit different

Anywho

You got a bill for 20k, or statement of benefits for 20k?

As in your out of pocket for that life saving flight was 20k???!

Independently wealthy and choose to not have insurance?


I worked in the industry for a while, we’d get slammed in the papers when someone got a statement of benefits in the mail “the evil people who saved my life are charging me 30k!!!”

Our corp people would look into it, call, we even had a whole team who helped people navigate their insurance, think our typical out of pocket was under 1k.

Not in NY......yet for SAR. Medivac is a different story. The search and rescues have gone up a tremendous amount here over the last several years - especially the last two years. People are going out totally unprepared with little or no planning or knowledge of where they are going at an alarming rate. I have a couple of good friends that are forest rangers and the stories I hear are incredible. Sounds like there is a undercurrent of possible billing in the future for rescues that involve people being unprepared/irresponsible. Whether that goes anywhere is anyone's guess.

Pete

NineThreeKilo wrote: .....You got a bill for 20k, or statement of benefits for 20k?
As in your out of pocket for that life saving flight was 20k???!
Independently wealthy and choose to not have insurance?
.....

The way it worked was, since the airplane owner (a local aviation museum) had coverage, my own insurance declined to pay.
I think the usual practice is for them to pay, and then subrogate it to the other insurance, but thats not what they did.
The owner's insurance waited until I'd gotten all the bills from the medivac, hospital, etc, and made a settlement with me to cover it all.
I then paid the airlift bill.
FWIW they did offer (as I recall) a 20% discount for my eventual lump sum payment, which of course I took them up on.
So they were paid about $16K, (sort of) out of my pocket.

BTW most people I know of that don't have health insurance are independently poor, not independently wealthy.

hotrod180 wrote:

NineThreeKilo wrote: .....You got a bill for 20k, or statement of benefits for 20k?
As in your out of pocket for that life saving flight was 20k???!
Independently wealthy and choose to not have insurance?
.....

The way it worked was, since the airplane owner (a local aviation museum) had coverage, my own insurance declined to pay.
I think the usual practice is for them to pay, and then subrogate it to the other insurance, but thats not what they did.
The owner's insurance waited until I'd gotten all the bills from the medivac, hospital, etc, and made a settlement with me to cover it all.
I then paid the airlift bill.
FWIW they did offer (as I recall) a 20% discount for my eventual lump sum payment, which of course I took them up on.
So they were paid about $16K, (sort of) out of my pocket.

BTW most people I know of that don't have health insurance are independently poor, not independently wealthy.

And the poor folk often pay the least, Medicare and Medicade or the like covers it.


The only people I have seen who got big bills for medevac were rich and decided not to have insurance (rare) or doing some sketchy insurance stuff with their insurance co.


Our average out of pocket was 1k or less.

Your situation sounds like a lawyer might have been needed, or at the very least I hope you have a new insurance company. I’d have imaged your situation if anything would have had money GOING INTO your account.

NineThreeKilo wrote:.....
Our average out of pocket was 1k or less. Your situation sounds like a lawyer might have been needed, or at the very least I hope you have a new insurance company. I’d have imaged your situation if anything would have had money GOING INTO your account.

I think you've misunderstood my situation, or maybe made some assumptions.
I came out OK-- When the dust settled, I had some money left over from the settlement.
But the bottom line is that Airlift NW still got paid $16K, no matter whose pocket it came out of.

FWIW I also got a bill from the local fire/rescue dept for the first-responder services, including ambulance / aid car,
but the amount was very reasonable.

hotrod180 wrote:

NineThreeKilo wrote:.....
Our average out of pocket was 1k or less. Your situation sounds like a lawyer might have been needed, or at the very least I hope you have a new insurance company. I’d have imaged your situation if anything would have had money GOING INTO your account.

I think you've misunderstood my situation, or maybe made some assumptions.
I came out OK-- When the dust settled, I had some money left over from the settlement.
But the bottom line is that Airlift NW still got paid $16K, no matter whose pocket it came out of.

FWIW I also got a bill from the local fire/rescue dept for the first-responder services, including ambulance / aid car,
but the amount was very reasonable.

Ah, ok, so end of the day you weren’t in the red for the medevac.

I’d also say for why it costs to have a medevac base, mechanics on staff, 4 pilots, 8 or so med crew all CFRNs and flight medics, Cames certified, 16k is a pretty good deal.

Only 1 retrieval (rescue) from Superior DL 35 mi north of Barstow, inside R-2515 with a clearance, low oil pressure (5 psi) precautionary landing 1.5 qts oil left in an O-300). San Bernardino County Sheriff picked us off the lake bed and made 2 trips (3 people) to the Barstow Sheriff's sub station. Only Org. I heard from was the Riverside FSDO wanting an explanation of why I landed where I did.

Is it fair to say, then, that there's a difference between the "S" and the "R" in "SAR?" The Search is probably carried out by some publicly funded entity that isn't likely to recoup their cost from the victim. But the Rescue might be handed off to some hospital or ambulance service, who'll probably send bills. Is that about right?

If so, does something like GEOS do any good? ISTM that it's just like any other ambulance ride.

Last summer my wife was airlifted out of the Idaho backcountry. My insurance company was billed $65,000. My insurance paid $9,000. Since we had a membership, we were not billed. It was my best investment. If you are unconscious, the helicopter will be called and you will be put on it.