Battson wrote:

A1Skinner wrote:Does upstream or downstream matter. I realize that wheels hydroplane at different speeds, but your wings create lift by airspeed and not ground speed.

I dont know how to hydroplaning the wheels personally, but I understand water current is a factor. Which makes sense, as it's the relative speed of wheel to water which counts - without that interaction you are just flying low!

But you have to keep your airspeed up enough to not sink also? Or am I not thinking correctly?
I'm more just into skiing rather then using it for landing. For now at least.

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Try waterskiing(or barefooting) at 5 or 10 miles an hour too slow behind a boat and you will see the difference upstream or downstream will do!!

A1Skinner wrote:I, for some dumb reason, really want to try it. I guess if I'm flying, I wanna have every bit of fun while doing it. Same reason I fly a plane that can do aerobatics and have 31" abws so I can land on sandbars I suppose.
Or I'm just stupid...

There is no greater proof of having the right stuff than to hydroplaning the wheels. If you succeed, you will walk with a strut in your step. If you fail, you might end up with a strut in your ass. I see a nosewheel in your avatar picture. What could possibly go wrong? Make sure you have someone hold your beer.

A1Skinner wrote:

Battson wrote:

A1Skinner wrote:Does upstream or downstream matter. I realize that wheels hydroplane at different speeds, but your wings create lift by airspeed and not ground speed.

I dont know how to hydroplaning the wheels personally, but I understand water current is a factor. Which makes sense, as it's the relative speed of wheel to water which counts - without that interaction you are just flying low!

But you have to keep your airspeed up enough to not sink also? Or am I not thinking correctly?
I'm more just into skiing rather then using it for landing. For now at least.

Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk 2

Big Rocks long props volume 2, "water play' covers wheel water operations on rivers extensively. Lot's of very valuable info. It's what grew my testicles big enough to try it.

kevbert wrote:

A1Skinner wrote:I, for some dumb reason, really want to try it. I guess if I'm flying, I wanna have every bit of fun while doing it. Same reason I fly a plane that can do aerobatics and have 31" abws so I can land on sandbars I suppose.
Or I'm just stupid...

There is no greater proof of having the right stuff than to hydroplaning the wheels. If you succeed, you will walk with a strut in your step. If you fail, you might end up with a strut in your ass. I see a nosewheel in your avatar picture. What could possibly go wrong? Make sure you have someone hold your beer.

That's the old plane. I have the little wheel in the right spot now, along with 31s.

Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk 2

A1Skinner wrote:

kevbert wrote:

A1Skinner wrote:I, for some dumb reason, really want to try it. I guess if I'm flying, I wanna have every bit of fun while doing it. Same reason I fly a plane that can do aerobatics and have 31" abws so I can land on sandbars I suppose.
Or I'm just stupid...

There is no greater proof of having the right stuff than to hydroplaning the wheels. If you succeed, you will walk with a strut in your step. If you fail, you might end up with a strut in your ass. I see a nosewheel in your avatar picture. What could possibly go wrong? Make sure you have someone hold your beer.

That's the old plane. I have the little wheel in the right spot now, along with 31s.

Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk 2

Well, in that case, I have some constructive thoughts. In my many years of experience of looking at pictures of hydroplaning airplanes, I've never seen anyone do it with flaps down. Also, if you get in trouble and apply full power with flaps on, there can be a tendency for the nose to go down since the flaps are being pushed up behind the center of gravity. Something to think about.

kevbert wrote:

A1Skinner wrote:

kevbert wrote:[quote="A1Skinner"]
I, for some dumb reason, really want to try it. I guess if I'm flying, I wanna have every bit of fun while doing it. Same reason I fly a plane that can do aerobatics and have 31" abws so I can land on sandbars I suppose.
Or I'm just stupid...

There is no greater proof of having the right stuff than to hydroplaning the wheels. If you succeed, you will walk with a strut in your step. If you fail, you might end up with a strut in your ass. I see a nosewheel in your avatar picture. What could possibly go wrong? Make sure you have someone hold your beer.

That's the old plane. I have the little wheel in the right spot now, along with 31s.

Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk 2

Well, in that case, I have some constructive thoughts. In my many years of experience of looking at pictures of hydroplaning airplanes, I've never seen anyone do it with flaps down. Also, if you get in trouble and apply full power with flaps on, there can be a tendency for the nose to go down since the flaps are being pushed up behind the center of gravity. Something to think about.[/quote]

Makes sense. There is one pic of a 180 with his flaps down, but he is going fast. I plan on making sure I have enough airspeed as well, but slow enough that the wheels don't bounce. Looking at more pics I do notice now that the flaps are all up. Thanks for the advice.

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Well, in that case, I have some constructive thoughts. In my many years of experience of looking at pictures of hydroplaning airplanes, I've never seen anyone do it with flaps down. Also, if you get in trouble and apply full power with flaps on, there can be a tendency for the nose to go down since the flaps are being pushed up behind the center of gravity. Something to think about.

Shit, I've been into the Makers Mark, hope I don't regret this tomorrow
Flaps create lift, if you are skiing on the water don't we want to be as light as we can get?
What happens when we are configurard for slow flight with flaps out and shove the throttle forward, one hand try's to push you into the back of the plane while the other is working for forward trim.

Makes sense. There is one pic of a 180 with his flaps down, but he is going fast. I plan on making sure I have enough airspeed as well, but slow enough that the wheels don't bounce. Looking at more pics I do notice now that the flaps are all up. Thanks for the advice.

Fast means anything above flying speed to me, 45mph and above, anything above that speed and you get the Cessna shimmy, I don't know about below.
As of recently I have quit waterskiing for long distances because of the work out it gives the gear.
Be careful and have fun!

Before I tried water skiing in '05, I read everything I could find about it on the web. One "expert" said to lock the parking brakes to prevent water spray all over.

I can tell you from experience that locking the parking brakes is a very BAD idea. Never ever lock the parking brakes whilst you are flying. At least on my mental and written checklists, there is no item that reads, "UNLOCK PARKING BRAKE PRIOR TO LANDING - - DUMMY!" What resulted was a very expensive lesson. Now it may well be a good idea to use the toe brakes, just get off 'em before you hit the beach or gravel bar.

At least in my Husky, landing and take off is normally done with full flaps - - lift off is around 40 mph indicated. Skiing full flaps too, if you intend to actually land or get slowed up on the water. Slowing to <35 indicated on the water feels dicey and tends to tighted the spincter muscles. Did it once unintentionally . . . did not see lowest speed attained, but did glance at ASI microseconds before that point and it said 35 mph - - I think. Fortunately, I've got 180 hp and a fast spool up MT prop, which promptly rescued my butt.

YMMV, proceed with lots of caution, and probably hull insurance (which I did not have when I taught my dog to roll over).

Well, I gotta say that im with Coyote. What incredible fun skiing is. Glad I tried it. No brakes on, the water didnt even spray enough to wash the dust off of the belly of horizontal stab of the plane. Worked well at 65 mph.

I have been using water for around 10 years now, I have used to get in places that I almost could not get back out of using water on take off. If you are not using flaps you are not really using the water for landing you are just driving around fast on the top of water for fun.

I have said this in a few of the videos I have made just to make a point that it can go bad very quickly if you don't know what you are doing, "it is one of the quickest ways to wreck a good airplane".

It is also a fun tool to use if you know what you are doing. Most people don't get to many chances to explore the slow side of hydroplanning because if you get a good scare from it you most likely never try that slow again.

I have played with it to the point of penetration when you are still out in the water but have gravel/sand below the surface. Once you get to this point and have the feel figured out you are pretty safe with what you can and can not get away with. You also know you would never want to penetrate in anything much deeper then about 6-12" of water.

If you want to get an idea of how much drag the water will present taxi out into a shallow 6-8" of water and try and use take off power. The water is just pure drag and you don't go anywhere real fast.

As someone else stated, I show a lot of water landings and talk about what has worked for me over the years in the Big Rocks & Long Props DVD Vol. 2

Full flaps=good.... no brakes=good.... ripples=good....

Any experts want to talk about cross currents? Like current with nice little ripples running 90 degrees to the approach path to the gravel bar. Love to hear if anyone has enough feel to notice the cross current, and if any effects were noticed.

I was just skiing down the river, not using it to slow me down for landing, but when the current turned cross ways when approaching a gravel bar, it was definitely pushing my plane sideways...

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Have tried really hard to stay away from this thread if for no other reason the title..."How do I hydroplaning the wheels"

...duh put down dah wheelz in da water and dah hopet ford do best...thats how it comes across to me...no offense...

Have read all the responses...its funny about the flaps, brakes etc. If your not using flaps your only skimming the water for the sake of skiing. Flaps are required for landing. The manuel flaps are key as you can get what you need, now. I generally always come in on approach with 20 degrees and then add as needed when on short final generally ending up with full flaps. The more flaps you have on water, you just add a little more forward pressure. If you cannot wheel land and always 3 point em, dont go and try to ski your plane.

Saw this video the other day...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2NvLqwjNr94

You think he could of landed any shorter by NOT using water? NOPE
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=21El16OPZoc

Listen to the throttle
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nj1tmnwiVyI&feature=fvwrel

You do not need brakes at all. Skiing or skiing to land short. Some say, why would you need water to land and that they can land just as short without the water. I personally disagree. Go water skiing behind a boat and then let go of the rope. You slowly start to sink and then end up floating on your life vest with your feet 5 feet below you. You can feel the wheels start to submerge as you coast to shore. As others mention, dont just go out and try it without some idea of making happen. Mauleguy said it best...its the quickest way to ruin your day... You can also add or take away power as needed. To much power/speed you will start to porpoise or maybe I should say, for me, I start to porpoise...no good. When you find the desired speed you settle in and you can go all day around the lake making turns etc.

Using the water to depart is also fine, you just need the speed to make it happen. Current plays a big part. If you decide to use a down river approach or departure you better account for the speed and direction of the current. I had the "Blank" scared out of me trying to land on a gravel bar and did not account for the bend in the river that was running at 6-8knts. The wind also changed and I ended up very lucky and able to abort at the last minute.

My first ever attempt of a water departure actually came only due to poor planing and ended up using the water as I had no choice. It was also with a nose dragger... Lowrider can elaborate more on that one... I was also very lucky then as I had just enough speed to keep the nose up but it did come down the second I touched water but again had enough speed. I ended up using about 100 feet of water to get out. Dont think I would ever use a nose dragger for H2O work ever again intentionally. Props to those that have and honestly its probably not that big a deal....but! Water / speed = skim....water / no speed = sink...regardless of your machine. Car, plane, tank, body, whatever...heck, Capt Sully even skimmed the big plane on the Husdson for just a little bit.

Capt Sully
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ejqYF89dEWw

I know many disagree with this whole water skiing thing but really its not that big a deal, I feel personally, but I also get to do it about ever day we fly here. I use it for both landing and departure as many of you have seen. We have a few spots to practice on our circuit, but conditions need to warrant. I could go on and on here. Bottom line, dont even think about it until you can ski (wheel land and keep your tail up) on pavement or grass before you decide to use the water. If your a bouncer on landings your gonna flip your plane on water. You have to commit and feel confident in the ability to not porpoise your wheels. Landing on water is like landing at night without lights. I think everyone would agree, some of your best landings are at night when you cant see your wheels getting ready to touch down.

Good luck. Bring on the neigh sayers...

AKT

OregonMaule wrote:

BobWhite wrote:Water skiiers:
Please do me (and others buying insurance) a flavor and be self insured.

I second that. Skis for snow, floats for water, Alaska BW for the rest.

Just curious Rob if you still stand by this comment...

Stinsoner...did you ever go skiing...seeing now that this thread is from 2008??

Coyote Ugly wrote:We can just lay in bed all the time hoping we don't get hurt, or we can enjoy life to it's fullest. People die flying too, should we not do that either? I know it's not for everyone, but damn it's fun.

Now Bull Riders, those guys are nuts and need to be locked up....

Only because this photo is worth a bump to the top of this thread!

Well, it sure is an easy way to get the dust off the tires

aktahoe1 wrote:

OregonMaule wrote:

BobWhite wrote:Water skiiers:
Please do me (and others buying insurance) a flavor and be self insured.

I second that. Skis for snow, floats for water, Alaska BW for the rest.

Just curious Rob if you still stand by this comment...

Stinsoner...did you ever go skiing...seeing now that this thread is from 2008??

Busted, I guess not. It sure is fun.

Cheers

Awesome vids Kevin!
He is how us mere mortals do it, just for fun.

Awesome Vid!! Gotta love the canoe pod!!