Anyone buy an Integra 406 ELT yet?
The ELT in my Skywagon is super old and needs updating. The Integra is appealing to me cuz its very light at 1.8 lbs, is 406 and has an internal GPS. Seems like a good deal. Thoughts?
Greg-
Integra ELT by Kannad
Mon Dec 10, 2012 6:41 pm
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Mon Dec 10, 2012 7:02 pm
Re: Integra ELT by Kannad
Don't know a thing about that one. I had an Artex ME406 installed in LRB as soon as they became available several years ago, well before the 121.5 frequency was no longer guarded by satellites. Although it doesn't have an internal GPS, it's hooked up to my 430W and updates and stores the GPS coordinates several times a second, so that it will broadcast them if it is ever activated. It only weighs 2 lbs, including the mounting tray.
Don't forget to register any 406 ELT--it's required by law, but it also means that they'll know who they're looking for as well as the physical description of the aircraft.
Cary
Don't forget to register any 406 ELT--it's required by law, but it also means that they'll know who they're looking for as well as the physical description of the aircraft.
Cary
"I have slipped the surly bonds of earth..., put out my hand and touched the face of God." J.G. Magee
Mon Dec 10, 2012 7:09 pm
Re: Integra ELT by Kannad
I've got an ACK 406 beacon, the least expensive I could find that also has GPS connectivity. It's connected to a Garmin 396. About $580 retail.
MTV
MTV
Mon Dec 10, 2012 7:11 pm
Re: Integra ELT by Kannad
I have the Compact 406 from Kannad. If I was to do this again, I would study up on things like do the new Kannad gps enabled ELTs need external power, extra dedicated antennae for gps, things like that. I have a feeling most all the built in gps elts will need both the power and antennae. A better bet would be find a 406 elt that you can hook up your garmin gps (or others) that you already have since it seems most are capable of running on battery power and not hard wired to the plane.
Just a thought.
Greg
Just a thought.
Greg
Mon Dec 10, 2012 7:55 pm
Re: Integra ELT by Kannad
The Integra needs no external power supply nor does it need an external GPS antenna. Super small and super light.
Anyone running this? Seems like a great choice...
Anyone running this? Seems like a great choice...
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Mon Dec 10, 2012 8:53 pm
Re: Integra ELT by Kannad
If it works out that it wont need external power or a extra antenna I would say go for it. I have been trying to figure out how to hook up my gps to my Compact Kannad but its not looking good. They are small and very light. Not the cheapest but I know I have no regrets other than not waiting for another year or two for the Integra to come out. Let us know how the install comes out if you go with this.
Tue Dec 11, 2012 5:30 am
Re: Integra ELT by Kannad
bigrenna wrote:The Integra needs no external power supply nor does it need an external GPS antenna. Super small and super light.
Anyone running this? Seems like a great choice...
Interesting.....I wonder how they're getting away without an external antenna for the GPS???? GPS signals don't penetrate metal. I see the max operating life is 24 hours of 406 and 48 hours of 121.5 mHz.....should be enough, at least on the 406 side....
Another "all in one" ELT with GPS built in is made by Emergency Locator Technologies.
Nice but speedy, and requires power and an external antenna.
MTV
Tue Dec 11, 2012 10:02 am
Re: Integra ELT by Kannad
Refresh my memory as to why a 406 is better than a 121.5? If nothing else, GA airplanes as well as airliners can monitor 121.5, not sure if airliners do 406 but I'm pretty sure most GA airplanes don't.
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Tue Dec 11, 2012 10:05 am
Re: Integra ELT by Kannad
New standard. These new models transmit on both. Some are triband.
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Tue Dec 11, 2012 11:13 am
Re: Integra ELT by Kannad
hotrod150 wrote:Refresh my memory as to why a 406 is better than a 121.5? If nothing else, GA airplanes as well as airliners can monitor 121.5, not sure if airliners do 406 but I'm pretty sure most GA airplanes don't.
http://www.sarsat.noaa.gov/406vs121.pdf
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Tue Dec 11, 2012 11:23 am
Re: Integra ELT by Kannad
mtv wrote:Interesting.....I wonder how they're getting away without an external antenna for the GPS????MTV
They aren't... It is a slick unit, pretty much plug and play... But the installation manual says in order for the gps and 406 to work on the internal antenna it needs a clear view of the sky. And the 121.5 is completely out without an antenna... I think the only reason for the internal antenna is for when you use it out of the aircraft, or for helicopters ... But it might work in an L21 ?
Take care, Rob
Tue Dec 11, 2012 12:12 pm
Re: Integra ELT by Kannad
This is all fine, IF the damn thing actually activates. From what I read, the "failure to activate" rate is dismal.
I spent over a $K & still have no confidence in it. Imagine sitting under a tree (if yer lucky) and not knowing if anyone knows you're down. UGH. I always carry a sat.phone & the Spot thingie. Usually fly alone.
I realize it's the cost of getting airplane thingies "approved" that nothing has changed since Rube Goldberg designed the trigger on these thingies, but if someone made an ELT that was about 99% dependable, I'd spend another $K.
I spent over a $K & still have no confidence in it. Imagine sitting under a tree (if yer lucky) and not knowing if anyone knows you're down. UGH. I always carry a sat.phone & the Spot thingie. Usually fly alone.
I realize it's the cost of getting airplane thingies "approved" that nothing has changed since Rube Goldberg designed the trigger on these thingies, but if someone made an ELT that was about 99% dependable, I'd spend another $K.
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Tue Dec 11, 2012 12:22 pm
Re: Integra ELT by Kannad
NimpoCub wrote:From what I read, the "failure to activate" rate is dismal. .
Are you saying there is data on the Integra RE: failure to activate, or just ELT's in general.
Greg-
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Tue Dec 11, 2012 12:48 pm
Re: Integra ELT by Kannad
I just read the "Never Again- Alaska" column in the Alaska Airmen's newsletter. A guy describes flipping his floatplane. Three days later, after constant submersion, the Kannad was still putting out a signal.
I've got the ELT brand GPS/406 myself. Been pleased, but haven't had to put it to the true test.
-DP
I've got the ELT brand GPS/406 myself. Been pleased, but haven't had to put it to the true test.
-DP
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Tue Dec 11, 2012 1:12 pm
Re: Integra ELT by Kannad
bigrenna wrote:NimpoCub wrote:From what I read, the "failure to activate" rate is dismal. .
Are you saying there is data on the Integra RE: failure to activate, or just ELT's in general.
Greg-
ELTs in general.
Apparently, the "switch" is a spring-held ball bearing which gets stuck with a bit of corrosion. Some ELTs have instructions to remove the unit once a year, turn it off, and bash it a bit to keep it loosened up. Sheesh!
Seems like there oughta be a better way to trigger these thingies. How do airbags trigger?
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Tue Dec 11, 2012 2:32 pm
Re: Integra ELT by Kannad
Not sure about other brands, but my memory says that ELT offers a 2-axis switch for most GA fixed-wing, and a 3-axis switch for helicopters that have a greater tendency to go in sideways. The rep said some of the supercub pilots were going with the 3-axis to help in the case of a low-altitude moose stall.
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Tue Dec 11, 2012 3:08 pm
Integra ELT by Kannad
hotrod150 wrote:Refresh my memory as to why a 406 is better than a 121.5? If nothing else, GA airplanes as well as airliners can monitor 121.5, not sure if airliners do 406 but I'm pretty sure most GA airplanes don't.
Short answer: As it is a digital signal instead of analog, it transmits data bursts containing a unique ID which if you registered it (which is not only a good idea, but is required by regulation) gives all the parties in the rescue chain a lot of information to go on including airplane description and emergency contact info. The burst transmission also contains your GPS-derived location coordinates, assuming it is connected to a GPS unit (or it is a model with integral GPS which not all of them are) and there is GPS signal integrity. Finally, the quality of the signal is such that even without GPS data it is easier to locate via Doppler methodology than the analog.
They also simultaneously transmit the old analog noise on 121.5 in case someone still bothers to listen, and for aerial search grid work.
By comparison, your old 121.5 model....well it just goes beep beep, and like the proverbial tree in the forest, if no one is there to hear...?
A modern handheld personal locator beacon gives you all of this too, except that it requires you to be in a condition to pop the safety and push the button.
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Tue Dec 11, 2012 5:23 pm
Re: Integra ELT by Kannad
denalipilot wrote:Not sure about other brands, but my memory says that ELT offers a 2-axis switch for most GA fixed-wing, and a 3-axis switch for helicopters that have a greater tendency to go in sideways. The rep said some of the supercub pilots were going with the 3-axis to help in the case of a low-altitude moose stall.
Nope. I specifically asked this question of those folks when I was ELT shopping. They use the same "ball bearing in a tube" switch that everyone else uses. The reason?? Simply the COST of certification of a new switch design. Estimated to be north of a million.....
Now, they may ORIENT the switch different for a helicopter install.
MTV
Tue Dec 11, 2012 5:44 pm
Re: Integra ELT by Kannad
mtv wrote:denalipilot wrote:Not sure about other brands, but my memory says that ELT offers a 2-axis switch for most GA fixed-wing, and a 3-axis switch for helicopters that have a greater tendency to go in sideways. The rep said some of the supercub pilots were going with the 3-axis to help in the case of a low-altitude moose stall.
Nope. I specifically asked this question of those folks when I was ELT shopping. They use the same "ball bearing in a tube" switch that everyone else uses. The reason?? Simply the COST of certification of a new switch design. Estimated to be north of a million.....
Now, they may ORIENT the switch different for a helicopter install.
MTV
Now I certainly may have misunderstood how the mechanism works. I did just check their website though, and was glad to see that I didn't pull that distinction entirely out of my ass.
Maybe they've got more than one switch, installed along different axes, for the helo units?http://www.elt406.net/products/ELTs/
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Tue Dec 11, 2012 6:12 pm
Re: Integra ELT by Kannad
Why I chose an Emerging Lifesaving Technologies 406 ELT
A) It has an internal GPS that constantly updates while in the air due having onboard power. Continuous updates will give last known position if GPS satellites lost during "event". Non-onboard power GPS ELT units such as Pointer do not try to update location until inertia switch is tripped or manual switch is tripped. I figure when tangled up in a canyon and/or possibly upside down it is not the time to try to acquire a satellite.
B) The antenna has (according to the mfg) a 270 degree "view". Again if in a "non-standard" attitude, looks as if it should have a decent chance of seeing the birds in the sky. Since I have a rag and tube aircraft, mounting the antenna inside the tube cage is an option. Thought it a good idea to protect the ELT and antenna so they both can do their job.
The only weakness I can see is the lack of a "walk away" antenna which would enable me to remove the unit and move it to a location with a better sky view. This means I will maintain my Acer PLB 406 as a backup.
My $0.02 worth.
TD
A) It has an internal GPS that constantly updates while in the air due having onboard power. Continuous updates will give last known position if GPS satellites lost during "event". Non-onboard power GPS ELT units such as Pointer do not try to update location until inertia switch is tripped or manual switch is tripped. I figure when tangled up in a canyon and/or possibly upside down it is not the time to try to acquire a satellite.
B) The antenna has (according to the mfg) a 270 degree "view". Again if in a "non-standard" attitude, looks as if it should have a decent chance of seeing the birds in the sky. Since I have a rag and tube aircraft, mounting the antenna inside the tube cage is an option. Thought it a good idea to protect the ELT and antenna so they both can do their job.
The only weakness I can see is the lack of a "walk away" antenna which would enable me to remove the unit and move it to a location with a better sky view. This means I will maintain my Acer PLB 406 as a backup.
My $0.02 worth.
TD
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