(Note: Moved here from the photo thread.)

It's so nice to see this float flying forum active and interesting, with great photos and videos.

At the 2017 Airventure I met Steve McCaughey, President of the Seaplane Pilots Association, at their booth. I told him that as a SPA member and active seaplane operator, I might occasionally enjoy participating in a seaplane forum to ask a question, make a comment, or just share experiences, photos, and videos, but that the SPA forum is dead. Some of the sub-forums go months or even years without activity.

I told him that I read the backcountrypilot.org forum and that now that they have a float flying sub-forum, I gravitate there. Since I also follow another type-specific aviation forum, I'm not going to follow three forums. SPA wouldn't make my cut. (I'm even away from this one for weeks at a time sometimes.) I mentioned that there are some highly experienced and knowledgeable seaplane contributors on BCP and many active operators.

So, my suggestion to him was that SPA look into making a deal with BCP and work it out so that anyone who is on the SPA website and clicks on the forum, it would automatically take them to the BCP float flying forum. In effect, sub-contract that aspect of SPA to BCP. I made it clear that I do not speak for BCP and have no position with them other than being a reader and supporter. It just seems to me that it would be a win-win. BCP picks up some users/traffic, and SPA gets a well-run, active float forum.

I have zero knowledge about how this works either technically nor with regard to respective rights, etc. As a businessman all my life, I find that if two parties agree that there is a win-win, then you can usually make the deal do whatever you want to accomplish.

Steve didn't "get it". At all. He said the SPA forum works fine and if it's not busy then that's the members fault, not his. I sorta tried to explain how online communities build and that I wasn't saying anything was anyone's fault, but I don't think I got far. I figure that he is a hired gun and that if his boss (the board of directors I assume) and the field directors saw value in having an active and engaged online community, then they would tell him to make it happen. I know a couple of SPA field directors and know some pilots who know others, so if this is anything BCP is interested in pursuing this, I believe we could drum up some support.

Meanwhile, keep the float posts flying!

Pierre

I feel your frustrations.

I understand your point of view.
I also understand Steve McCaughey's point as well.

There was a group of seaplane pilots saying the same thing about ten years ago. They had suggested making the forums at SPA more robust, and creating a community out of it. It fell on deaf ears. So, one of these fellows had a background in IT I think, and went off and made his own community: Seaplaneforums.com
I participated in that for a while. However, the main guy there was a real character, and very opinionated. On top of that, it just seemed there was a political slant to everything. It rubbed me the wrong way, and I left, as most other forum members. That "community" collapsed 5 or 6 years ago, and the main guy there converted it to...seaplanemagazine.com or something like that.

Blah Blah Blah...yeah.

So, this is where I agree with Steve...
The forums there are what members make of it.
Which, is....nothing.

I've concluded that the seaplane crowd is mostly made up of baby boomers. This is not to criticize that generation, but it's just my observation. The seaplane community is more or less older white guys. There's nothing wrong with that, but, they're not ones making videos and posting on forums. When the forum is already in that community (at SPA), it really does not attract outsiders. Additionally, seaplane flying has big price of entry, and interested individuals may be priced out of it.
The plus about this baby forum at BCP, as well as other social media platforms, is that the platform itself casts a wider net (those interested in general aviation) and as a side interest, we get some traffic in the seaplane aspect of things.

BCP is a vibrant, informative site that takes its strength from the variety of forums it offers. As a result of this scope there is plenty of “cross talk” and a true sense of community. I’ve both participated and lurker in other sites on occasion but have always return, it’s my “home” now. It’s perfect the way it is without any need to align with any others.

Interesting. I appreciate your commitment to BCP, Pierre.

I can see it from all dimensions, but, I understand Steve's perspective the most. No organization wants to outsource their member communication to another similar organization that's not a technology vendor, or something outside their own industry.

The BCP charter is entertainment, information, and connecting people for this narrow slice of the aviation community. The SPA charter is probably something more like being the champion of seaplane access rights...I'm not sure TBH. Should I join? I'm a seaplane pilot with 7 hours. Will I learn something there?

In this day and age, hosting a communication medium is nearly free of cost. There are many hosted solutions just waiting for someone to turn the key. The big unknown is how much engagement can you get? BCP is 15 years old and we've collected a lot of members over the years. There's lots of information archived here. I tried to get our community invested in building a knowledge base here, and while many people did help out, it was still like pulling teeth as a curator to get that info. Few members really want to help build a better website – they want to communicate and interact, and if good information is committed here as a result, that's a plus. And that's why I'm so down on Facebook. You don't end up with that net asset of archived information.

I don't see any advantage for the SPA in sending their members here. They'd lose out on dominion of member communication data and their own place to hang their brand, even though it would be more convenient for guys like you who are already using this space.

I think the resolution is that SPA can continue doing what it does well.

Those who want to discuss float flying and seaplanes with a backcountry bent can engage here. No partnership or anything is necessary. But if anyone asks where a good place to talk float flying is? Send them here.

As noted above, there's a lot of history regarding the topic of "Seaplane forums" and SPA.

I would argue that the SPA (not necessarily the seaplane pilot community, in my experience) is dominated by a Board of VERY old gents, NOT by a bunch of baby boomers.

I quit SPA a long time ago, largely because the organization no longer does much for the seaplane owners and pilots community. It became an "old boys club" a long time ago.

I personally like Steve, he is a vibrant and active booster of seaplanes, but the organization seems to me to be adrift....pun intended.

I'd leave things the way they are. The current forum regarding seaplanes on BCP is entitled Seaplane photos.....which, if anyone actually pays attention to the title of the forum, suggests its just about current photos of seaplanes.

If you want to expand that forum to more variety in seaplane "stuff", then change the title, or start another thread titled something about seaplane operations. I'd be happy to post some stuff, and I think there are others as well. It COULD be a much more active and useful forum.

FWIW.

MTV

SPA introduced me to some amazing people who know about seaplanes like no others. Yes, some folks were from another generation. But, for instance, when J. J. Frey called me back and chats for a half an hour about flying then that in itself is worth the membership.

I don’t see flying floats in my immediate future so the membership expired. The membership was however a “Different experience” compared to other groups but, highly valued. The SPA is really very autonomous and therefore, blending it with other (grassroots) groups should be considered. Cooperation might even be necessary to exist.

Having an “*Active Directory” (LDAP or similar) login cross servers (and forums) will happen one day. But, it will require significant collaboration between organizations.


*https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Active_Directory

JJ Frey will talk to anyone about floats, and he’s as knowledgeable as anyone on the subject. Go to OSH and see whose booth he sits in: EDO, not SPA. Guess who pays the bills?

MTV

mtv wrote: The current forum regarding seaplanes on BCP is entitled Seaplane photos.....which, if anyone actually pays attention to the title of the forum, suggests its just about current photos of seaplanes.

Say what? We have 12 pages of topics. The photo thread is a single topic, which happens to be popular and keeps getting bumped.

https://backcountrypilot.org/forum/pilo ... operations

Who's the old man, now???

mtv wrote:JJ Frey will talk to anyone about floats, and he’s as knowledgeable as anyone on the subject. Go to OSH...

I would love to meet JJ. Unfortunately, Oshkosh is not in the cards any time soon.

But I didn't miss your actual point. Regardless whether the SPA isn't an internet destination, finding great mentors in person ain't happening. Were left with the internet. It has to happen somewhere for me, late at night, from the comfort of my boxer shorts.

BCP has become my favorite forum - I don't think we should try to merge it with SPA.

BCP has quite a bit of it's own identity which is great.

Zzz wrote:

mtv wrote: The current forum regarding seaplanes on BCP is entitled Seaplane photos.....which, if anyone actually pays attention to the title of the forum, suggests its just about current photos of seaplanes.

Say what? We have 12 pages of topics. The photo thread is a single topic, which happens to be popular and keeps getting bumped.

https://backcountrypilot.org/forum/pilo ... operations

Who's the old man, now???

Current, as in currently active.....most of those others are very specifically titled as well, and not likely to draw attention in a more general sense. In my experience, people tend to post on threads that have current content.

Old?? Shit, Man.....you have no idea how old I feel some mornings.

MTV

This thread struck a raw nerve with me because SPA used to have a fantastic forum going back at least a dozen years or more. It had a very active group of very knowledgeable and cordial float pilots. Unfortunately, the software was a bit antiquated, although it did the job quite well of exchanging information. Because of this, SPA embarked on a program of upgrading the software, which ultimately killed the forum. The new software didn’t work and by the time (many months) that it was straightened out, all the participants had departed, never to return. I know MTV remembers that forum as he used to be a very active participant.

I have brought this topic up a couple times with Steve McGaughey at the AK Trade Show and suggested going through the archives to find the old SPA forum participants (on that forum everybody used the names their mothers gave them) and invite them back. Apparently this was not possible as SPA kept no records.

It took a long time, but I finally found the BCP forum, which has a terrific bunch of just as knowledgeable and cordial members. The amount of quality information that gets exchanged here is fantastic and I really appreciate everybody’s input. I have really benefited from many of the topics – thanks guys!

Ross

Don't mess with prefection, BCP is ticking along perfectly from where I'm sitting

Mapleflt wrote:Don't mess with prefection, BCP is ticking along perfectly from where I'm sitting

Except for that elusive "like" button

As someone who runs a forum even larger than BCP, anytime I get requests/suggestions from members to make a deal with another site to redirect all their traffic to mine, it invariably ends with "thanks, but no thanks".

There's much more to it than you'd initially think, and having a situation where it makes sense to do so would be quite rare.