I'm looking at a 182 that has an O470J. I know there are several variations of the 470, curious to know if there's one that stands out as better than the rest? Or one(s) that you want to shy away from? I don't know the differences between the different suffixes. I definitely have some interest in a Pponk upgrade when overhaul time comes around, although this particular one is very low time. So I may not get to that point for a LONG time. (Which is fine with me... Gives me time and money to spend on other cool stuff first like Sportsman, Airglas, MT, ADS-B, etc.). I've read that some engines are cheaper/easier to Ponk than others... something about having to change the crankshaft on some... where does the J stand on that? One thing I've read about Pponk that disappoints me is that it is not approved for mogas. And I have ethanol free mogas available to me right on my home airport, AND even cheaper at a station in town (for filling cans & bringing to the plane at my backyard strip where I'll keep the plane). So, is there an STC for autofuel available for the -J? And if there is, how do you feel about running auto fuel? Even if an STC is available, would you skip it and stick to 100LL for any reason?

Brad

Never heard of a J in a 182. The first 182's came with a L which uses the newer style cylinders. J can be a good engine but wonder why they went backwards to a J. J was in the last part of 1954 and all 1955 180's.

Newer engines year 2000 or newer have the crank that works with the PPonk (in case of the O 470R, not sure about the J, if its newer might have the crank, what year is the engine?

Interesting! The plane is 1961 model and "sounds" in the ad like the original engine, although it doesn't specifically say that it is. Here's a copied & pasted direct quote from the email he sent me:

"It's no damage history and approx 300 hrs on its first overhaul of a 470j model. 300 on prop"

I will have to ask him if it's had an engine swap at some point for some reason. Or maybe he's mistaken about the J?

That kind of info is one reason I love this site... so much knowledge here, thanks!

L is what came in the first 182's. It is the same as the K that came in the 1956 180 and later for awhile except for the induction because of the nose wheel. K.L, and U have the right crankshaft to make a Pponk because of the two sets of counter weights that the A,J,R,S don't have. K and L are identical cranks and U is different and was looking at new prices, the U was cheaper than the K,L for some reason.

Crankshaft prices for the two kinds
http://shop.aeroinstock.com/p-12762-cra ... 1498827467
http://shop.aeroinstock.com/p-12750-cra ... 1498827467

Probably not a J. There is an STC Mogas. I have had it in the three 182's that I have had. I burn it regularly. The Ponk does not have an STC for Mogas cus it cost to much to get. If they did it would require 91 or better octane. If 180 Marty had a Ponk he would probably run strait ethanol.

The 61 is last 182 with the trimable horizontal stabilizer. The last 182 with the very light controls. Good choice

Tim

qmdv wrote:If 180 Marty had a Ponk he would probably run strait ethanol.

whee wrote:

qmdv wrote:If 180 Marty had a Ponk he would probably run strait ethanol.

He has done extensive testing. Some of witch I have witnessed.

Tim

.

glacier wrote:.....I like my 470J, but I'd not revert to one if I had a later model installed. I'd also not steer away from a potential plane purchase just because it has one. Nor do I think I will swap out my J when it comes time to rebuild it.

Never heard of anyone "downgrading" to a J from an L (or whatever later model engine) in a C182.

My 53 C180 had the 470A for approx. 40 years. Switched to a K in 1993 or so.
Been a very good engine in the close-to-25 years since.
That said, if they kept the A for 40 years, they must not have been too unhappy with it.
I've never owned one, but I know a number of guys who've had J engines in their 180's and had very good luck with them.
One guy in particular ran his well past TBO.
He took it to Steve Knopp (of Pponk fame) for an engine overhaul,
and ended up with an R installed in it's place.
I asked him why, he said "they're a better engine"--
but I don't know how he could have found fault with his his J engine treated him.

Like Glacier, a J engine in a potential airplane purchase sure wouldn't be a deal killer for me.
And I'm not sure I'd "upgrade" at overhaul either.
But I will say that the 4-bolt exhaust flanges on the K and later engines
are a big improvement over the 2-bolt flanges on the A & J.

If 180 Marty had a Ponk he would probably run strait ethanol.

Love options, because of the hurricane trashing Houston refineries, EPA is bending the rules a little to allow more E15 (15% ethanol) a little early to stretch the gasoline supply. One guy on Supercub forum said he couldn't get out of Florida the other day because of no gas------wonder if the E85 tanks were dry down there. Sometimes think about getting a 185 but then you're locked into one fuel. A 180 or 182 with a low compression Pponk would probably be the ultimate for power and fuel chose----legal or not.

So your comments bring up 2 more questions:

Is an autofuel STC paperwork only? Or is there a pshycial difference or alteration made to the engine or carb or fuel system that makes it possible?

And what is it about the trimmable stabilizer that folks posting on here seem to prefer over the aerodynamic trim tab? I've only ever flown the types with trim tabs (66 J-model & 68 L-model and various 172's & 175's) and never considered the difference. I did look at a 61 D model once that was said to have been a little loose in the tail (trim system). Is this common? And easy to fix?

I must say I do love the looks of the 1960 & 1961 models with their fast back, extra side window, and swept tails. Also love manual flaps. But... LOVE the room & comfort of the later ones. Makes it hard to decide. Probably will come down to whatever I find the right "deal" on.

NETX wrote:Is an autofuel STC paperwork only? Or is there a pshycial difference or alteration made to the engine or carb or fuel system that makes it possible?

ONLY paperwork? You're calling a placard (sticker) ONLY paperwork? You must not know the powers of a well placed sticker in regards to making fuels suitable for engines!

LOL! Powerful sticker!

I think the STC also requires checking that one of the proper carb floats is installed--
either metal, or better yet one of the blue foam floats.