Few people, and fewer government employees, like to the be the first to do things. Maybe one of the sections in the knowledge base could be a collection of best practices on how people have gotten landing permissions and strips setup and, if not blessed, at least not blocked. The same is true about the liability legislation that passed in a couple states. I can easily see that it would be easier to persuade the 5th person to permit something (or pass a law) than the first. Not only do people not like to be trail blazers on things, but we could benefit by being able to politely answer previously raised objections before the new target even thinks of them. Makes us look smart and like we're not trying to hide things.

I read an article a while back about how a surprising amount of legislation for one of the major political parties was actually written by a guy working pretty much alone and the finding partner advocates in various states. It was proving to be an effective strategy that we might benefit from.

Just a thought.

Evolution is always easier then revolution and it leaves less of a mess. Capturing valuable lessons learned and data in the knowledge base is important, but so is having a powerful search engine or index so relevant material is easy to find. My biggest problem with well stoked databases is poor indexing or search capabilities that render the data useless because you can't get to relevant items. Unfortunately, that organization is not my forte. I'm also new enough to this sector of the flying community that I have little or nothing to add - yet. I am willing to work on projects that benefit the community though. Like my dog, I just need to be pointed in the right direction. Once launched, I hunt just fine.

That would certainly make it easier to understand how to proceed. There are likely a lot of good things we could get done if we simply understood where to start and how to proceed; they are otherwise ignored to our detriment.

I guess I'm hoping that we can get things to the point of maybe a couple dozen pages. I decided to write my note while thinking about that stuff I'm doing right now to build the sales pipeline at my company.

In addition to people not wanting to be first movers, they also have very limited time to do detailed analysis of issues.

Maybe I'm being optimistic, but in my minds eye I was hoping we might be able to put together a handful of data sheets (one for public land, one for liability legislation, one for private land, those kinds of things) each of which is 2-5 pages long and contains the summary of what we propose, why it's beneficial, common objections/answers and references to places (and, ideally, people) that have done it before.

Anything more detailed than that and we greatly reduce the likelihood of holding peoples attention long enough to engage them.

Then, from there, if we have the draft legislation or draft landing permits we have a good chance of closing the deal.

rw2 wrote:I guess I'm hoping that we can get things to the point of maybe a couple dozen pages. I decided to write my note while thinking about that stuff I'm doing right now to build the sales pipeline at my company.

In addition to people not wanting to be first movers, they also have very limited time to do detailed analysis of issues.

Maybe I'm being optimistic, but in my minds eye I was hoping we might be able to put together a handful of data sheets (one for public land, one for liability legislation, one for private land, those kinds of things) each of which is 2-5 pages long and contains the summary of what we propose, why it's beneficial, common objections/answers and references to places (and, ideally, people) that have done it before.

Anything more detailed than that and we greatly reduce the likelihood of holding peoples attention long enough to engage them.

Then, from there, if we have the draft legislation or draft landing permits we have a good chance of closing the deal.

Much of this should be available already through other members on this site or their associates. Perhaps all that would be needed is sanitizing and editing into a generic version once a document is obtained. That may work well for liability legislation and for private land permissions. Public land use (federal) is a different animal. It is a very important aspect and one we should all be involved with since that is where the most land available to access resides. Advocacy groups such as RAF and Idaho Aviation Association and others are taking steps everyday. Would it make sense to put our efforts behind those organizations with guidance and overview documents aimed to support those efforts?

blackrock wrote:Would it make sense to put our efforts behind those organizations with guidance and overview documents aimed to support those efforts?

I'm agnostic as to where it happens. I'm a member of RAF and would join another organization if they took this ball and ran with it.

For that matter, as of now, I'm unaware of anyone doing this. I'd be happy to be proven wrong.

rw2 wrote:

blackrock wrote:Would it make sense to put our efforts behind those organizations with guidance and overview documents aimed to support those efforts?

I'm agnostic as to where it happens. I'm a member of RAF and would join another organization if they took this ball and ran with it.

For that matter, as of now, I'm unaware of anyone doing this. I'd be happy to be proven wrong.

OK, I'm not sure what you have in mind then with respect to public lands.

blackrock wrote:OK, I'm not sure what you have in mind then with respect to public lands.

Maybe I misunderstood your comment. I'd like to see boilerplate documents and reference victories that can be used when approaching new authorities to get permission to create/resurrect air strips. All I meant is that I don't care what banner this effort is flying. If it's BCP or RAF I don't care.

Are you saying that RAF already has such docs?

On a different note, there are good releases out there that elevate liability to the land owner. Caveman is one as an example and there are others. I have spent the past 10 years driving around to various land owners / ranches, etc asking for permission. This is one way to open up a number of options legally without much hassle. Around here we are very lucky to have Nevada and its limitless BLM lands. Not to mention various reservoirs that allow float planes and access to land below the high water mark. It just takes a little research.

AKT

aktahoe1 wrote:On a different note, there are good releases out there that elevate liability to the land owner.

Elevate or alleviate?

aktahoe1 wrote:On a different note, there are good releases out there that elevate liability to the land owner. Caveman is one as an example and there are others.

Do you know anyone willing to provide us with copies for the database?

aktahoe1 wrote:I have spent the past 10 years driving around to various land owners / ranches, etc asking for permission. This is one way to open up a number of options legally without much hassle.

Did you just wander up and say "hey, mind if I land?"

Any tips on how you persuaded people to allow you to use their land?

aktahoe1 wrote: It just takes a little research.

AKT

Do you mean that we should all do our own research or that each of us could do a little research in our areas and all of us could pool the information?

I posted a comment related to this at http://www.backcountrypilot.org/forum/p ... ?f=10&t=69