I truely believe if you are a normal person of average health and you are 55 or older .....you can't possibly answer "truefully" all the questions on your 3rd class medical exam and not be on the waiting game....I'm throwing the B@## SH*# Flag!........... At the same time I have a CDL and pass the part hands down....so now I can jump into a 80,000lb vehical and drive down the road coming within inches of your vehical going the othher direction......there is something wrong with this picture.

O.k. I done ranting....whatever#@$%&^%$#@

Not sure of your rant. I'm 68, just passed my Class II, and I truthfully answered all questions. I am on a Special Issuance, which was issued 2 years ago after I had recovered from radiation treatments for prostate cancer. But now it's just a matter of getting updates from my urologist and oncologist and submitting them to my AME. He issues the medical, subject (as is true of all medicals) to second-guessing by the FAA Aeromedical Branch.

So what's the beef?

Cary

The AME is not my Doctor Doctor. I have a very complete physical every year in December (11 years in a row now). This last December my BP was 140/88 and it was recomended that I go on a low dose of Diavan to help with the BP and future possibility of hardening of the arteries. O.k. I buy into it. Today I go for my 3 class, be honest list the drug, my BP today 136/80. New on the report was the Diavan. The Ame wants a report from my Doctor Doctor, my Doctor Doctor says he has nothing to do with FAA and even though my very "Complete" physical is not even 5 months old I need to go through all the blood work UA crap I just did. Worse yet both the clinics are operated under the same management company with the same name but are 40 miles apart and don't recognize each other's work. Wish i could find a good Doc that could do both. I'm sure another $1,000.00 of test and 6 weeks of waiting will clear up any issues......very frustrating, and seems there is a power struggle between clinics.....

(This may be a hijack of the thread.)

I'm on a special issuance 3rd class. I'm interested in a commercial but getting re-checked out in a retractable so that I can take the commercial flight test, (have studied the ground, can easily pass the practise), doesn't make much sense if I can't get a class 2 medical. My reason for pursuing it is so I could sell (not that it would happen) any photographs/movies I happened to take.

I did not realize that class 2 also has special issuances. Does anyone know whether it is only available if you started with a class 2? The frequency of testing is not an issue to me because I am being monitored by my doctors on 3 month intervals. Feeding paperwork to the FAA yearly is the least of my worries.

Thanks,
Dick

I failed my last CDL physical, the hearing part. I went back the next day (Doc in the Box at WalMart), and easily passed. The doc that day simply whispered a bit louder. I found my last few Cdl phy's more demanding then my 3 rd class's when I still went that route. Rightly so. My crane weighs 40 k +, the plane 730, I drive in traffic, fly in remote areas mostly, so Joe Sixpak is much more endangered by my crane driving then my S-7 flying!

courierguy wrote: so Joe Sixpak is much more endangered by my crane driving then my S-7 flying!

That is your opinion Tom...

Jus kiddin............. calm down

rjb, I don't think you need a commercial license if your paid work is incidental to the flying. You are getting paid for your pictures/movies (hopefully), not for flying the plane.
61.113
...
(b) A private pilot may, for compensation or hire, act as pilot in command of an aircraft in connection with any business or employment if:

(1) The flight is only incidental to that business or employment; and

(2) The aircraft does not carry passengers or property for compensation or hire.

(c) A private pilot may not pay less than the pro rata share of the operating expenses of a flight with passengers, provided the expenses involve only fuel, oil, airport expenditures, or rental fees.

etc.

Having said that having a commercial or at least going through the training won't hurt a thing.

Might I suggest going Light Sport.
I'm a couple years younger than you Bighorn and had delays in my medical, waiting on OK city to okay things. After going through this along with the worries of wondering when they are going to say "rejected" I figure it might just be easier to fly in the light sport category. Heck, most of my flying is local and solo anyways.
I know you have aspirations of flying a biplane, warbird, the space shuttle, and so do I but sometimes reality slaps us upside the head and tells us we can keep dreaming but it ain't gonna happen.
Good Luck,
Keith

This medical certificate stuff is kind of a buncha BS. The stuff we're talking about don't seem to be safety of flight issues if they are addressed, yet they cause all kinds of hassle & red tape when they come up with the AME & FAA.
For example, my blood pressure has been creeping up on me for years. I finally redlined @ 155/95 at the exam last year for my 3rd class ( but I did pass). Started BP meds shortly thereafter. Now, the next time I go in, I'll have to have recent blood work done, an EKG, & god knows what else. But if I had left it untreated & continued to squeek by at the upper limits, there'd be no redtape at all. Kinda inclines a guy not to address things sometimes, instead of being proactive & trying to fix what's wrong.
I really hope that the self-certify proposal goes through.

Well, not doing something about high blood pressure is like denying that the light is red, so you'll go through the intersection anyway regardless of traffic, i.e., it's a killer.

There are pros and cons of having your AME be your doctor doctor. The pro is that sometimes doctor doctors don't have a clue about FAA requirements. So the pilot needs to keep on top of it by checking first whether any new meds are allowed, whereas an AME will already know and won't prescribe disqualifiers. The con is that if the AME in his role as doctor doctor discovers a disqualifying condition, he can't overlook it at the next FAA medical, whereas if the doctor doctor discovers a condition that might be disqualifying, he can help his patient overcome it so that when the next FAA medical rolls around, the pilot will pass it.

As it happens, my AME is my doctor doctor, and over the years, it's always been that way. It's worked well for me.

As for whether the holder of a Class III with an SA can upgrade to a Class II with an SA, I don't know. I've always had a Class II, for over 39 years. AOPA's medical people might be able to tell you.

Cary

Cary wrote: Well, not doing something about high blood pressure is like denying that the light is red, so you'll go through the intersection anyway regardless of traffic, i.e., it's a killer.........

By ignoring it & hoping for the best, like I'd been doing, there's no red tape (as long as I squeek by). Makles it easy to rationalize myself into doing that because of less hassle. But of course it makes much better sense to address the problem, which I did. BP's fine now, after meds, less salt in diet, and moderate exercise. Still need to knock off 20 pounds, kinda sorta working on that. (starting tomorrow )

Me too. I already started on it, and I've lost a tiny bit, but I have a good 20 to go.

Cary

Cary wrote:....There are pros and cons of having your AME be your doctor doctor. The pro is that sometimes doctor doctors don't have a clue about FAA requirements. So the pilot needs to keep on top of it by checking first whether any new meds are allowed, whereas an AME will already know and won't prescribe disqualifiers.....

I have a doctor doctor, just go to the AME for my medical certificates. That's all he really wants to do BTW (AME exams). Should have asked him about permissable BP meds, as later my doc doc didn't have a clue. I tried to google up a list of approved BP meds, but discovered that the FAA does not publish that info (except in the AME guidebook).I did find an unofficial list which included the HTCZ (diuretic) I was prescribed, but why does tyhe FAA make it so damn difficult? You'd think they'd rather have people address these issues instead of ignoring them. At least publish a list that the average MD and/or pilot could access.

This is where your AOPA membership is worth the $$$. They have a complete list of approved meds, info on "unapproved meds" and forms to guide you through the SI process on simple things like hypertension. And, if it's not in black and white on the web site, there will be someone to answer your questions by phone.

There are thousands of guys out there with Class I/II/III medicals on SI's for blood pressures, Type 2 diabetes, all kinds of stuff. Some of it's a pain in the ass, some of it is simple to deal with. And this I do know.... The hard way.

Gump

As one ages you always worry about passing that 3rd class. My wife has blood pressure problems, on meds. She has a blood pressure checker, I have had no problems so far but use the monitor monthly, throw away the salt shaker. My hearing is just fair and my AME says your just getting by, my response is with the noise canceling stuff I hear as good as a new born, he just smiles. I just slid by another 3rd class in March, also renewed my CDL then. The gal where I renewed my CDL ask why I was renewing the CDL at 76 and I said I'm still driving tow trucks when my son's need me. By the way she failed to give me an eye test, I thought that was mandatory. I've been lucking out on eyesight, 3rd class still says (must have reading glasses available in cockpit).
Ron

Back to the Doc (AME)this a.m.
Requirements
A clinical examination including 3 BP teast 24 hours apart, resting EKG, Fasting plasma glucose, cholesterol (LDL/HDL) triglycerides, and creatinine levels and a stress test....... the most iritating about all this is I had everything done but the stress test at my Doctor Doctor in Dec 2011
BP this a.m @ the Doc office (Under stress) was 136/84......I don't know, the last time I looked my Doctor Doctor had a M.D. behind his name.

A good Doctor should be promoting good health and helping us to stay in the left seat not hinder it.
What I would like to have is a mock up sheet that would be as if I was getting a physical by and AME that my Doctor Doctor could use everytime I go for my yearly.
The other thing I learned is to have my yearly exam only 2 weeks b/4 my Flight exam that way I have fresh data.

More later

From experience I can say don't get a physical while, or immediately after, being sick. Your body is doing weird things and will throw strange numbers at the Doctor which he is bound to follow up on.

The third class medical is a bunch of BS. There is no credible evidence that even one accident has been prevented by it. I'll bet anyone on here dollars to donuts that it's caused more deaths than its prevented. Hows that, you ask? I know for a fact that, for fear of losing their medical, pilots have left untreated conditions that ultimately lead to their demise that, if found early and properly treated, might have had a different outcome.

There's also the gross over medication of the US population at the behest of the pharmaceutical industry. Once upon a time, the "normal" reading for the higher blood pressure number was "100 plus your age." Now, 120/80 is considered "pre-hypertensive" and they want to put you on medication that interferes with your heart rhythm, causes dizziness and fainting, and keeps you from getting a boner. Most "studies" pointing to the dangers of various conditions that the drug companies just happen to have a pill for are funded by the drug companies! I'm sure we have a couple medical types on here, maybe even an AME. Before you jump in and tell me I'm wrong, tell us who sponsors much of your continuing education? Yep, it's our good friends in the pharmaceutical industry.

Truly independent studies have shown no increase in mortality rates for individuals with BP up to 150/100. No, I'm too lazy to look up the citation and I'm not trying to "prove" anything anyway. I'll share another data point though - a friend just had a heart attack. She was discharged from the hospital but readmitted a few days later because her BP was 155/95. A mutual acquaintance who lives in Sweden commented "they wouldn't consider that high over here."

I guess light sport works for some people but some of us have a mission profile that requires something faster or able to carry more or to fly at night, IFR, or in major terminal areas. I had high hopes for the AOPA initiative but they saddled us voluntarily with most of the same limitations as light sport. WTF?

The medical requirement for PRIVATE pilots needs to be eliminated, period. I don't need one to drive a car, pickup, SUV, or most motor homes (do you need a CDL if it's over a certain size/weight?). The same should apply to privately operated aircraft.

Best,
O-2 (who just got in BP riled up)

Just some additional thoughts

I have cooled down some since my first post. When I was younger, I read about these issues but really didn't pay much attention because it didn't effect me. Now that I'm at "The Age" when things start going the other way i need to pay more attention.
In my case what is most disappointing is 1) I reported the use of a "approved" drug for my BP. I still believe it was a good decision (for my general health) to start taking this med. 2) It was prescribed by a M.D.
Is a M.D. a better M.D. just because they are an AME?
It is an antiquated system that needs to be changed. The system should be promoting good health and helping pilots improve their health and stay in the pilot seat. It should not be a pass or rejected therefore you can never fly again system. I would venture to guess that there are more than just a few pilots out there that do not answer those questions truefully and I would guess that there are more than just a few pilots that are postponing taking a corrective med because they do not want to put up with the B.S. that I'm currently doing. And I would guess that there are more than a few pilots out there that have let their medical expire in fear of the "rejection and never fly again" outcome.
In my case I truely believe my AME is abusing his granted power by delaying my 3rd class medical. I also believe that I will get my 3rd class medical but at a cost that should not be. At this point there is nothing I can do but jump through all the hoops to satisfy a power hungery AME, which is disappointing.
Again is and M.D. a better M.D. because he is and AME......I think not. An AME should not be able to delay or stall a Health Certificate when you are following all the rules simply on the basis that He was not the one that did my test.

Anyway for the future of General aviation there needs to be a major change for the HEALTH of the pilots and the HEALTH of General Aviation.

You might oughta consider a different AME next time, if you don't trust this one.

Cary