http://www.foxnews.com/us/2013/11/30/pl ... latestnews

Edit: Better, more detailed write up-second post below referenced source

What a shame. Praying for the survivors and the families of all involved!

More details: http://www.adn.com/2013/11/30/3204898/4 ... crash.html

Cary

Talked to one of Terry's co-workers. Sounds like a CFIT. He overflew town, came overhead across the runway on the crosswind, never activated the lights, and flew into the hills by the dump. And of course, wx was crap.

Sad deal.

Gump

Has to be a painful loss to the communities. Prayers for all.

Responders and aftermath: http://www.adn.com/2013/11/30/3206516/v ... -with.html

Very sad: MGBWT.

The weather at the time was pretty crappy, from the news reports. I just looked at the approaches there, and it would have been tight anyway. If the airplane was carrying a load of ice, that might explain the "fall out of the sky" comments--208s aren't famous for carrying much ice before they can't fly any longer, although otherwise they're considered pretty good airplanes. I had a friend flying for UPS or FedEx (can't recall which) back in the early days of 208s whose 208 loaded up and crashed in the Colorado mountains--he survived and made it out.

Cary

Cary wrote:The weather at the time was pretty crappy, from the news reports. I just looked at the approaches there, and it would have been tight anyway. If the airplane was carrying a load of ice, that might explain the "fall out of the sky" comments--208s aren't famous for carrying much ice before they can't fly any longer, although otherwise they're considered pretty good airplanes. I had a friend flying for UPS or FedEx (can't recall which) back in the early days of 208s whose 208 loaded up and crashed in the Colorado mountains--he survived and made it out.

Cary

The 900shp Garrett Texas Turbines and Blackhawk -42 conversions haul ice. Some of the airlines put them in but are now taking them back out because of the increase in fuel burn. Some may rethink that.

The weather at the time was pretty crappy, from the news reports. I just looked at the approaches there, and it would have been tight anyway. If the airplane was carrying a load of ice, that might explain the "fall out of the sky" comments--

Who knows. Terry was a very experienced pilot, and quite proficient in the Caravan. I was told he was VFR for this trip, or as MTV says, "pretend VFR." A load of ice and a tail stall, maybe. Or just a plain old fly out past the airport to get set-up to work your way in, and not see the little row of hills in the snow and whack 'em. End result is the same.

Gump

Those photos don't suggest to me an accident as a result of a tail stall, but I'm not an accident investigator. A lot of emphasis has been placed on the "fact" that the pilot was flying in freezing rain by a Trooper spokesperson.....who is also not an accident investigator. There can be freezing rain in one place but not in another nearby.

As Gump says, there are some hills around St Marys, and maneuvering below a 300 foot overcast (if that report was indeed accurate...and it may not be) in the dark and restricted visibility is not a fun place to be, regardless of what airplane you're flying.

Those remote weather machines have REALLY helped flight safety in Alaska, as have the weather cameras, but the remote weather machines sometimes don't provide a real accurate picture, and most pilots up there have probably proceeded into a situation they wished they hadn't, based on the "sounds" of the weather there.

This is a terrible tragedy, in any case. We may never learn the sequence of events that led up to this tragedy. The fact is, air taxis in Alaska often operate on pretty thin margins, and it doesn't take much of a "surprise" to make your day a LOT less pleasant.

Hard to imagine the strength of that young mother, losing her child, then walking to town to lead rescuers to the crash site.....I hope she's able to cope in future.

May they rest in peace, and the survivors recover fully.

MTV

The 900shp Garrett Texas Turbines and Blackhawk -42 conversions haul ice. Some of the airlines put them in but are now taking them back out because of the increase in fuel burn. Some may rethink that.

Out of curiosity, which airlines are you referring to? I know ERA was very disappointed in the Blackhawks and has had them for sale for quite a while with no takers. As for the Garrett Caravan conversions in Alaska, only the machine based in Juneau is a Texas Turbine machine, all the rest are done by AeroTwin with a 950shp conversion, and no one with a AeroTwin is thinking of going back to a PT6-114A.

Era talked someone into a trade-out. We speak to one of their mechanics charged with the swap out on a near daily basis. Since Era encompasses a few different names these days, I said operators, which is probably misleading now that I think about it.

That you Cable?

I spent a lot of time flying out of St. Mary's, a regular bunghole of a village with a miserable airport, only eclipsed by the cobbled together trailers that made up the lodge (they all where at different angles, so it was kind of like a carnival fun house). We did bird surveys on the Yukon delta for about 8 hours a day at 150'. So we would fly down the bank, and climb up the cliff to land straight ahead on the runway, I used to pity the ones that had to descend into the runway.

I've owned and operated about 30 Caravans since 1990. I really didn't care for the Garrett conversion. Its great if you want to operate on improved surfaces, or haul skydivers to altitude. There is no inertial separator or any FOD protection. The Caravan has a habit of throwing slush/mud up from the nose wheel to the prop into the engine, even with the AeroTwin nose wheel scraper. At least with the standard engine configuration you have an inertial separator. While many do not think this an issue, price out 1st & 2nd stage compressor blades. They are pricey and require an unstacking and test cell run to put it back together. While Garrett has excellent customer service, nothing is for free.

gbflyer wrote:Era talked someone into a trade-out. We speak to one of their mechanics charged with the swap out on a near daily basis. Since Era encompasses a few different names these days, I said operators, which is probably misleading now that I think about it.

That you Cable?

Yep that would be me...

Capt. Chaos wrote:

gbflyer wrote:Era talked someone into a trade-out. We speak to one of their mechanics charged with the swap out on a near daily basis. Since Era encompasses a few different names these days, I said operators, which is probably misleading now that I think about it.

That you Cable?

Yep that would be me...

Welcome! Good to have another guy on here that does the stuff most of the rest of us just bullshit about.