I am in the market to replace my very old 2nd Nav/com (currently a Narco MK12A) in my 182. It is huge, old, it does work, but has a huge power supply in my soon to be extended baggage area. I need to get rid of this boat anchor before I do my extended baggage.

I am not interested in going to a Nav/com, just want a good flip-plop, secondary com radio(must be certified) and I'm wanting to keep the price down.

This is what has caught my eye so far. A Val Com 2000 http://www.aircraftspruce.com/pages/av/ ... om2000.php

I sure like the price but how does it work? Is anyone on here have any experience with this radio or this brand and can give any feedback?

Or maybe someone has a different radio suggestion and I'm open to that as well.

Thanks in advance!

I've never fitted this brand, but looks similar to the old King 96/196.
Basic and easy to use, main freq selected, and standby freq set, push the button and the freq switch.
It's nice because it allows you to preselect the freq you require, like an ATIS and flip between them as required.
Other options I would consider are, used King or Garmin from a Avionics shop thats been tested, Some of the Garmin GPS have a built in Com/Nav function, or a Becker which is a nice secondary VHF as it installs in a 2.25" instrument hole saving on panel space

Just curious what the rest of your stack looks like? Will you need to be changing anything else soon? I only ask because I think this unit is pretty sweet, and I plan on putting it in my 180 sooner then later. Gives you everything in one for a very reasonable price and opens up lots of panel space.
http://www.aircraftspruce.ca/catalog/av ... par200.php

Sorry if I'm out of line on my suggestion.

David

I think the inexpensive standard is the ICOM A200. Those have been around forever and seem to go forever. They now make the A210. They should be just as good as the ol A200. I really like the display on it as well.
Next is the Garmin GTR 200. Pretty dang close in price. I do love Garmin products.

As for the VAL. I had the older VAL COM 760. There was nothing wrong with it other then the dumb toggle switches to change frequency. I eventually busted one off with my knee. Got it fixed. Stopped fast on the way to the radio shop and the thing went flying out of passenger truck seat and broke the other switches. Anyways i installed new toggles and broke them once more. It was a good radio other then that.
I think the VAL COM 2000 has an ugly display that looks better suited for a Russian Tupolev. I would spend the extra couple hundred and get a radio with a bit more features and non russian display.

Thanks for all the thoughts and recommendations guys! I guess I should clarify a bit more. I've got plenty panel space(especially after the old narco radio is gone) and would like to keep my radio in my center stack. I plan on moving my garmin 396 panel mount up to the top, and have my nav/com under the gps, and my 2nd com under that, followed by my transponder. I'm not looking to upgrade any other avionics at this time. I do like that all-one-unit David...that's pretty sweet! I just don't want to be spending that kind of coin on avionics at this point.

PAMR MX-- I definitely like the looks and features of all the other radios you mentioned better, but according to the "fine print" those are all for "experimental use only" (non tso'd) So they can't be installed in my Cessna Unless I'm missing something.....or they have different versions of those that I haven't found yet. I'll keep looking.

Thanks!

Wow i suggested all NON TSO radios what great advice.

I always thought the ICOM 210 was TSO since they no longer make the 200. Looks like im wrong!

The garmin GTR200 is non TSO. You would have to get the GTR 225 for a TSO radio.

Do you really need a second com radio? IMHO the whole digital flip-flop thing has taken away a lot of the reason for a second radio. While on freq with ATC or the CTAF, I can flip over to the AWOS / ATIS for a quick listen. When on approach to a towered airport, I dial in the ground freq so when I turn off the runway I can just hit the button.

If the second radio is for redundancy, remember that an avionics master switch or audio panel is a potential single point of failure that can shut down the whole works.

The Val radio looks awfully bare bones, the Garmin has too many buttons. I'd vote for the Icom A210, it's just right-- or if you can find one, an A200. I had one of those in my last airplane and really liked it. They came in both TSO'd & non-TSO'd versions ($100 difference) if that's a factor.

I've had VAL COM-760's in my current plane and previous plane for 17 years total, never had any complaints about them other than the switches are a bit inconvenient. I did have to install a noise filter in both planes to keep the strobe noise out of the audio on both planes.

I just removed a King KY97A from my 182 when I upgraded my panel. It was working great and is on E-BAY.

Tim

You CAN install an NON-TSO in a certified airplane. I have an ICOM A210 in my Citabria and did quite a bit of research on this. I talked to two seperate FSDO's (local and another across the country) and got the same answer. Basically, if it's not in your Type Certificate (TC) and as long as it's legal to operate as an aviation radio by the FCC then you can install it in a certified aircraft.

We were never able to find any requirements in the FARs for TSO'd radios in VFR aircraft.

How many KX-170B's have you seen in certified Aircraft? The 170B was never TSO'd.

I like the 210, but the screen is hard to see in sunlight and if you wear polarized glasses. I'd go for the Garmin GTR 200.

Chris

I installed a PS Engineering PAR-200 and love it. It includes a really good 4-place intercom and audio panel, but for the radio portion it uses a Trig TY91 transceiver. You could get just the Trig if you don't want the other bells and whistles of the PAR-200. The Trig has worked very well for me and is small and light weight.

sticknrudder wrote:You CAN install an NON-TSO in a certified airplane. I have an ICOM A210 in my Citabria and did quite a bit of research on this. I talked to two seperate FSDO's (local and another across the country) and got the same answer. Basically, if it's not in your Type Certificate (TC) and as long as it's legal to operate as an aviation radio by the FCC then you can install it in a certified aircraft.

We were never able to find any requirements in the FARs for TSO'd radios in VFR aircraft.

How many KX-170B's have you seen in certified Aircraft? The 170B was never TSO'd.

I like the 210, but the screen is hard to see in sunlight and if you wear polarized glasses. I'd go for the Garmin GTR 200.

Chris

This makes me curious Chris. So can I put a radio that's made for a experimental in a certified plane?

David

A1Skinner wrote:

sticknrudder wrote:You CAN install an NON-TSO in a certified airplane. I have an ICOM A210 in my Citabria and did quite a bit of research on this. I talked to two seperate FSDO's (local and another across the country) and got the same answer. Basically, if it's not in your Type Certificate (TC) and as long as it's legal to operate as an aviation radio by the FCC then you can install it in a certified aircraft.

We were never able to find any requirements in the FARs for TSO'd radios in VFR aircraft.

How many KX-170B's have you seen in certified Aircraft? The 170B was never TSO'd.

I like the 210, but the screen is hard to see in sunlight and if you wear polarized glasses. I'd go for the Garmin GTR 200.

Chris

This makes me curious Chris. So can I put a radio that's made for a experimental in a certified plane?

David

What radio is it? If it's approved by the FCC as an aviation radio and meets the standards for TSO, but not actually gone through the process, I'd venture to guess yes as long as you do the appropriate logbook entry for a minor alteration and adjust the W&B accordingly.

Here is the reference the FSDO pointed me to:

FAA Order 8900.1 Volume 4 chapter 9 Section 2 paragraph 4-1178 General (C) Definitions

(10) Meet Minimum TSO-Established Standards: Means that the equipment need not have TSO approval, but only meet requirements set by the TSO.

Again, YMMV widely on the FSDO, but worse case it's a 337.

Chris

OK. Thanks Chris.

.

Good luck finding a shop that will install a non-TSO'd radio. I agree it is not a requirement but I couldn't find a shop that would put one in a certified plane. They mumble something about losing their repair station license.

What I've heard is that you need a TSO'd radio if the airplane is gonna be certified for IFR flith. For VFR, non-TSO'd is OK. Now there's thousands of King KX170 type nav-coms out there, some no doubt installed in IFR-cert;d airplanes, yet that radio was never TSO'd.

My personal experience came about 6 years ago when I wanted to install an Icom A200 in my C150TD. A friend who's an IA talked to his FAA inspector, whom told him that a 337 would be required-- not just a logbook entry. (I've heard people who should know argue this point, but that's another subject...). The inspector also told him that if the installed radio was TSO'd, the IA could just sign it off, but if it was non-TSO'd a field approval (FAA inspector sign-off) would be required. Since the A200 was available either way, I just spent the extra hundred bucks to get the TSO'd version to make the paperwork as easy as possible.

hotrod180 wrote:Do you really need a second com radio? IMHO the whole digital flip-flop thing has taken away a lot of the reason for a second radio. While on freq with ATC or the CTAF, I can flip over to the AWOS / ATIS for a quick listen. When on approach to a towered airport, I dial in the ground freq so when I turn off the runway I can just hit the button.

If the second radio is for redundancy, remember that an avionics master switch or audio panel is a potential single point of failure that can shut down the whole works.

The Val radio looks awfully bare bones, the Garmin has too many buttons. I'd vote for the Icom A210, it's just right-- or if you can find one, an A200. I had one of those in my last airplane and really liked it. They came in both TSO'd & non-TSO'd versions ($100 difference) if that's a factor.

When my radio went ka-put while talking to big-sky approach on Sunday right as they kicked me over to tower, I sure was happy to have the Narco piece of junk laying around.

It's also good to monitor an untowered airport advisory before ATC kicks you over, but a "monitor" function can be an acceptable substitute here.

Radios seem to fail more often.

I've had enough radio failures over the years in various airplanes, some with only one radio, that the redundancy of having a second as a backup is something I like. If it were in an airplane that doesn't go anywhere, just flit around the area, just one is fine. But once in awhile I like to go places, sometimes IFR, and having the second is comforting.

Cary

Reviving an old thread.....
A buddy of mine just installed a Flightline FL-760 in his battery-only-system Luscombe.
It has a built-in VOX intercom, but since it's set up to cut out when anyone transmits on the active frequency, he didn't hook it up since he already had a nice panel-mount intercom wired in.
Simple installation- just bolts into a standard 2-1/4" instrument hole. No tray, just a serial-type connector for power ground & intercom / headset jack connections, and a coax connector for the antenna.
Assuming the panel is stout enough, at about 14 ounces it can probably just bolt in but since it is about 6" deep he installed a support bracket.
So far, it seems like a nice little unit. They list at $690 or so from Spruce & PCA, but he got his for about $600 from Wicks. A lotta bang for the buck.