I've been having those lately, but I know why I'm anxious - I'm trying to work the mechanical bugs out before flying a plane that sat for six years until I rebuilt her wings down the Alcan to my new home. I love my plane, but I don't trust her - small and not-so-small mechanical issues keep coming up, and weather, and money, and I'm waking up in a cold sweat thinking "What am I doing?"

I think a lot of what Zane is describing is the battle in our subconscious between our sense of adventure and our common sense. The older we get the more the common sense wins out because it has that powerful tool that our parents and wives use on us. "I told you so"

Here is some fuel for those of you with the subconscious "wires" dreams.

at the 2:00 minute mark, there starts some "wire flying".



and in the last 30 seconds of this one.

Wow! Therapy on BCP! It never ceases to amaze me how useful this site is. Honestly, I'm not being a smart ass.

Zane, I know that the first page or so wasn't exactly on the point that you were talking about, but I'm glad that it went that direction. I'll say ditto to the same disclaimers about being a competent pilot, etc. About three years ago I was starting to make my plans for the flying season and was caught really off guard by this anxious feeling that I was having over the trip as I did the planning. It really caught me by surprise. When the time to fly came, the feelings disappeared as soon as I started the drive to the airport and never returned for the trip or for the season. Then, the next year, the same thing happened. This year, I experienced it a little bit, but not as much just a few weeks ago before the Caveman Fly-in with the same result.

After 23 years of flying, I had never had this kind of anxiety...not even while flying bigger, higher, and more people. For me, I know exactly where it comes from...having my kids on board. While my wife and I are adults and can make the decision to accept the additional risk, my little ones can't. I have always stressed to myself, and my students, that you have to be proficient and do everything that you can to mitigate the additional risk of flying in general, more so for the stuff we do. That doesn't mean that bad things cant' happen, but that I will know that I've done what I can do, and should do, to keep them safe. Overall it is a healthy thing, I think, but am glad to hear that others have experienced it as well. At first, I was a little embarrassed that I was feeling anxious and wondered "what is wrong with me". Like others have said, as I get older, I think I just become more aware of what is important, that I'm not immortal, and that I now have a much greater responsibility.

Thanks for the discussion guys. It was very good to hear everyone's input.

I've at times felt a bit on edge when I fly since I started at 14. But my airplane obsession always easily won out. It was a particularly epic tension when I was obsessed with hang gliding and paragliding for over a decade, getting ready to launch off a cliff or getting vacuumed up by a mountain wave. The risk/reward ratio began to sag after having a couple of acquaintances perish and I quit to stick with planes. It wasn't a clear necessity to quit, and my blood still boils when I see a tiny colored dot topped out at cloud base on an epic cross country flight. It was just a personal calculus.

I do not mind the edginess anymore- it makes me deliberate and aware. The risk/reward calculation is heavily in the favorable zone after more than 25 years (and happy outcomes with two power failures). My experience with hang gliding tells me there might be a personal calculus to quit when I get older, which is something unthinkable when I was 14 or 18. That point is nowhere in sight at the moment. My hang gliding friends who were in their 40's when I was in my 20's are in their 60's now, and still enjoying hang gliding adventures.

I usually wake up from a dead sleep with my heart pounding out of my chest every year before a checkride. Going on twelve years now and it still gets to me. It's funny about the being trapped below the power line dream, I thought I was the only one who ever had those. It's true about getting older though, I got my license at 17 and I look back on the stuff I did back then and I get really anxious, like clam hands and everything, just from thinking about it. Maybe we really were invincible back then, life was sure a lot more fun without having to worry about things.

The things I did when I was in my late teens through my 20's were, in my opinion more dangerous than flying: Lead climbing on natural protection, racing motocross, jumping off bridges, and a few more that I can't admit in a public forum. I never had dreams about the risks of those. Flying was a good hobby to transition into because of the emphasis on safety and method, and the consequences are... well you know the saying about how flying is like the sea. I think it improves you to a certain extent. Even my driving changed.

Best thread/conversation about flying I have ever had/read..whatever. Nice to know Im not the only one. Its my humble belief that personal anxiety is healthy as long as you can still grit your teeth and shit a pile deep enough to land in when the time comes..

Cheers guys

This is old stuff,

But it is worth repeating given the nature of this thred.

"When one learns to fly they are given two bags. A LUCK bag and an EXPERIENCE bag. The LUCK bag is full and the EXPERIENCE bag is empty. By the time the LUCK bag becomes empty: the EXPERIENCE bag better be full."

I must have been given a huge LUCK bag.... as my LUCK bag has carried me through many close calls..... well beyond an EXPERIENCE bag that has long been overflowning. Last winter while test flying a Socata....the engine quit at 1,500 ft. over a densly wooded and rugged, hilly, area. Convinced I was going to crash into the trees.....somehow I stretched it to a small muddy field.....missing the tree tops at field edge by 5 feet with the wing stalling all the way to the ground. Collapsed the nose gear and stopped in 150 feet.

I was to have flown it from the Mid-West to n/e New York the very next day. A trip that extended over 1,000 miles with a lot of rugged terrian in Penn and N.Y.

Figure my LUCK bag is finally empty now. Sweet dreams.

bob

TwinPOS wrote: ...Its my humble belief that personal anxiety is healthy as long as you can still grit your teeth and shit a pile deep enough to land in when the time comes...

Cheers guys

Personal anxiety is healthy, keeps you on your toes, to be aware of your surroundings and never take anything for granted. All you can expect of yourself is do the best you can do, be the best you can be, and be a good honest person. Whatever happens, good or bad, was meant to be. You cannot let dreams act as a premonition...

Funny the power lines dreams should come up, I grew up in a family that owned (still owns) and operates an electric utility. From the basic farm-type labor chores of going to the power plant at 6am to fill up the day-tank before catching the bus to school, to pumping many (many many many) thousands of gallons of diesel off the barge, building a tank pad for some 100,000 gallon fuel tanks with a dozer, and working up on the poles in a 'beater with a heater' 1980's line truck (all before I was 18). I always disliked that work, and became the blacksheep by dreaming of, and going on to, flying for a living (with the full support of the best family ever!).

I don't remember when I started having the "flying under the wires" dreams/nightmares, but I was always flying a DC-3, and I don't know why...(ASEL only, that's me!)

A small 'pilot light' of fear/respect is a good thing that helps you keep your brain thinking about what you are doing and the 'risks'.....
My dad used to say it was the guy on the construction site that got too comfortable with heights that was the 'accident waiting to happen'. It would happen on the 'high iron', guys get too comfortable being 20+ stories high, and forget where they were on the iron and turn around and walk out into (very) thin air (before the days of OSHA and netting). Same with climbers who stop double/triple checking their knots/rigging, or divers, or etc. on ANY/ALL high risk activities.
We all know people who paid dearly for their complacency (if you've been around for long)......
I think that the fear 'flame/pilot light' needs to be somewhat conscious....and not just subconscious or in a dream-to work for you.

mho
lc

I'll just say from my limited experience that flying anxiety is a healthy virus that should spread. Fear is good. When is the last time you saw someone who felt invincible that you'd trust to drive or fly you, on or in anything? I bet if you went, you were sorry, and you cinched up your seatbelt...

born2flyak wrote:I'll just say from my limited experience that flying anxiety is a healthy virus that should spread. Fear is good. When is the last time you saw someone who felt invincible that you'd trust to drive or fly you, on or in anything? I bet if you went, you were sorry, and you cinched up your seatbelt...

I've slept with one eye open on more than one occasion.

Dot, I know exactly how you feel. My 175 sat for 25 years and it was a mess. From frozen pulleys to cracked coils. When I first started flying it, I never realized a plane could have so many strange noises and vibrations. Now, every time I take it out I wonder if there is anything we missed. I'm slowly getting to trust it and it has been doing great. I'm sure your plane will turn out fine.

I have those trapped under the wire dreams, then there's a gap and I yank back only to discover the gust lock is in place. Then I'm trapped under the wires again.

On a related note, I did an hour of simulated engine failures at different positions and configurations in the pattern yesterday. Boy it's a sumbich to get a 182 turned around while trying to establish best glide in a turn, while retrimming, while informing others of your antics, while.... Straight ahead really was usually the best option.

svanarts wrote:

CAVU wrote:Haven’t had it for a while, but I used to dream that I take off from a road somewhere, rotate and accelerate in ground effect, but am trapped below an endless web of power lines.

Very, VERY common dream among pilots. You'd be amazed how many pilots have this same dream. I've had it.

Mee too. Ran through some wires 20 years ago though so that might be a reason.

Jamie G

I have a subconscious anxiety about not being able to fly but not any about flying

I believe a lot of us fly for the rush. For the fun as well as the pleasure. I got in to flying mostly for the rush. Landing where other would not think of. I have been a adrenalin junkie for most of my life. I have down hill skied in some of the toughest terrain around . I whitewater Kayak and I crossed the Alaska Range on foot not once but two times. I climbed glaciers and raced motorcycles. For me flying at one time was a rush. Now I fly for the fun of it. I fly for relaxation. We do it for the love of flying...


Ken in Alaska

Zane wrote:So what is it that leaks out of the subconscious at night?

How 'bout this:

Eastern Oregon plane crash
B-17 Crashes and Burns in Aurora, Il
Goodyear blimp explodes, pilot dies
Cessna 170 Emergency Landing
4 lost in Wendover Crash today
Nevada WX nails another C172
Aircraft down at KAST
Prairie dogs almost wrecked my plane!
drug plane crashes in NM lake
cub crafter plane down @ rocky mtn airpark
The Deadliest Plane Crash
More Sad News
Pacer crashes into a minivan
Aircraft Slams Into 4 Buildings
Husky crash near Laramie

A little over two months' worth,
tom