Hello all,

100hr training wheel pilot with ZERO tail-wheel looking to purchase a 55' Cessna 170. It seems a hull value of 35K with the standard 1,000,000/100,000 coverage will run me ~1600 bucks. Does this sound reasonable? It requires 15hr dual and 10 hr solo before I can carry passengers. Plane will sleep outside because hangers around here are running almost 1K/month and I'm not paying that; I can tie it down on pavement for 35/month.

-Chris <-- Tired of renting; time to buy something!

Sounds VERY reasonable to me. Get the training from someone who really knows these aircraft.

Then go have fun with the airplane.

MTV

Sounds about right. Wish I were paying that little (little something about the airport I'm based at )

If the insurance is from a reputable company that stands behind the policy, I don't think you can do much better. I have 1000 hours, 850 T/W with 120K Hull on my 180 and I'm about $1,900. As MTV says, get some good training. If your instruction to meet the insurance requirements doesn't give you all the training you need, go get more. Use the plane to go find someone who can make you proficient, not just legal.

TJ

I have a '53 170B, and my first year premium on $45,000 hull was about $1,400 though a broker who was underwritten by AIG.

I had about 14 hrs tailwheel time logged at that point. Checkout required was 5 hrs dual and 5 hrs solo for pax (not enough in my opinion, I have gone though a few pair of underwear.) I am now with Avemco and take advantage of the WINGS credit discounts whenever I can. I'm down to about $1,295, so not much improvement.

If you have no tailwheel endorsement or logged time, I think you'll have to be happy with your quote. There is a huge break at 100 hrs tailwheel time and 500 TT (or so I hear ) logged.

Thanks!

I really had no idea with my only comparison being insurance would be 500 bucks on a Cessna 150. I guess airplane insurance isn't that bad considering that back when I was 18 (1995) with a brand new Z28 I was paying 4K/year.

Now to finish convincing the wife that we need our own airplane. About how it will help her get to the beach without traffic (we like going to Montauk, NY) and I can take more hiking trips with the boys.

-Chris

TJ Carr wrote:If the insurance is from a reputable company that stands behind the policy, I don't think you can do much better. I have 1000 hours, 850 T/W with 120K Hull on my 180 and I'm about $1,900. As MTV says, get some good training. If your instruction to meet the insurance requirements doesn't give you all the training you need, go get more. Use the plane to go find someone who can make you proficient, not just legal.

TJ

It was through the AOPA; they had to contact me because the online quote thing doesn't work for tailwheel planes and my hours.

Your not far from me; I fly out of KLZD (previously 5B3)!

Glad I didn't take the first quote. I had the winter to look around and the wide spread on the hull side of these quotes put the range from four companies from 3200-6200 with similar liability and injury coverage as you have. My hull is insured for 140,000. Mine is tailwheel and experimental both with only seven copies flying that I know of and only two in the states. There is one out of fuel crash in Canada on floats and into the trees for an accident history. My recent tailwheel time worth talking about is 60hrs. I was told the premium would probably drop after 100hrs.

Zane is right, once you start logging hours you'll see the premium start to drop. Your premiums will start to level off around 500 hours or so with at least a couple of hundred hours T/W. It's usually a combination of TT and T/W and the insurance will vary with Make and Model. If you want another number, try William Grohs Aviation Insurance at the Oxford Airport in Oxford, CT. Bill, Jamie and Michelle have done well for me.

TJ

mtv wrote:Sounds VERY reasonable to me. Get the training from someone who really knows these aircraft.

Then go have fun with the airplane.

MTV

To piggy back a bit on Mike's post...the premium sounds about right...don't be concerned so much about the hours required (although you must comply with them) and concentrate more on landings in various wind and runway conditions. 15 hours of dual X-country 15 landings will not teach you TW flying. Burn up the pattern and shoot for 10 landings per hour...this will teach you the skills needed to safely fly that new toy.

Find a tailwheel pilot who also happens to hold a CFI to teach you the art of TW flying...stay away from the CFI who also happens to have a TW endorsement.

I'm out of KSNC, Chester. Send me a PM sometime and let me know how you're making out on your instruction. After you get checked out I'll introduce you to the guys over at RICONN, RI 11. It's a private grass field in the Pine Barrens of Rhode Island dating back to the 1920's, not too far from you... neighbor!

I just had a quote done for a taildragger Pacer, $25k hull. 130hr PPL, 30hrs of Tailwheel, zero in type for $1400/yr with the same liability.

Just curious, do the insurance companies ask WHEN your tw time was?

porterjet wrote:Just curious, do the insurance companies ask WHEN your tw time was?

Nope...but they do ask how many hours you have flown in the last 12 months.

I fly an '03 Husky, 300+ PPL, 145 TinT, 135K hull, with discounts for safety seminars and training, currently with Avemco at $2700. If you are still sitting in the chair, I expect another -10% at 166hrs Tin T. There were considerable benefits to Avemco regarding my wife training in the AC and other pilots flying it. The first year I had the plane was $2276! I guess that company got wind of other company rates and their quote for year two was $4100 with staggering requirements for other pilots and riders for my wife to train. Fabulous service from Avemco!!!

Mine just renewed I thought I was going back to AIG but the agent put me with a carrier named Chubb issued by Federal Insurance Company. It saved me $69 from last year anybody dealt with this carrier?

Glidergeek wrote:Mine just renewed I thought I was going back to AIG but the agent put me with a carrier named Chubb issued by Federal Insurance Company. It saved me $69 from last year anybody dealt with this carrier?

That would be Starr Aviation...they write on Chubb paper. Good company and easy to deal with.

Ditto on Starr Insurance. Got mine through Regal Aviation Insurance (office in Oregon and Idaho. They beat all the others hands down. No deductible and no limitation off airport landing on cool million liability.

There is a pretty extensive insurance thread starting with:
viewtopic.php?f=6&t=5280

$1600 with zero TW time seems really good to me but I would still get some other quotes through someone that will shop around for you.

lowflybye wrote:
Find a tailwheel pilot who also happens to hold a CFI to teach you the art of TW flying...stay away from the CFI who also happens to have a TW endorsement.

+1
If you cant find a CFI that is a 170 pilot then find a old crop duster pilot that happens to be a cfi...them guys can fly anything. When I was starting out in the Luscombe I couldnt find a CFI that had any Luscombe time. I found a ag pilot that was getting ready to retire...he really taught me to fly.