I'm building a 4-place experimental and am trying to figure out what's the best modern day setup? I do intend actual off-airport rough work with this aircraft.

If I want 31" bushwheels, what's the hot ticket for wheels and brakes? Grove? Would you pay the extra money for Cleveland if you didn't need an STC?


It seems grove has an array of offerings--
Axle diameter - 1.25 or 1.5?
Caliper piston diameter for 2-piston calipers?
Disc thickness?

And now for a question that may be obvious but I honestly do not know for sure-- Are all bushwheels tubeless? That would mean you need wheel halves with an o-ring between them?

So, the question is, your buying everything new, what do you get?

Thanks.

SF,

Can't speak to your brake questions, but Alaskan Bushwheels are self-contained units, the "tube" is built into the tire itself, the valve stem is actually in the sidewall of the tire, so you don't need wheels with o-rings. Standard split aircraft wheels work fine.

Be sure and post progress photos and stories of your build, will be great to follow along. Have fun.

Barnstormer, thanks. You kinda jarred my memory. Not sure how one could forget such a thing, but I do remember now that I have seen some up close in a hangar. So that is good-- no tubeless stuff to worry about.

In my not so humble opinion, Cleveland's are the best way to go. Yes, they do cost more. Consider that every FBO shop has Cleveland parts and rarely to pads etc. need to be ordered because they are already in stock. The others are not parts compatible with Celevelands so if you need parts, be prepared to wait at least a few days for them to arrive.

I have worked with Robbie over at Grove on the development of a wheel/brake package for a heavy high performance turbine airplane, and can not say enough good things about the products, service and the people over there. I wouldn't think twice about using their wheels and brakes if I could. Clevelands have worked flawlessly for me over the years too.

Treefeller wrote: I do intend actual off-airport rough work with this aircraft.

If I want 31" bushwheels...

Thanks.
SF

I think you should want 35s

Even the best of brakes aren't failure proof. I have Clevelands on my P172D, and I had to replace the left caliper a couple of years ago. I'm not a mechanic, so I don't quite know why, but first it leaked all over so that I had no left brake, then the temporary fix of a new O-ring held for a couple of months until the annual, but it had started to seep a little by then.

Cary

I think Grove does make a quality product but Blackrock has a point, if something fails you are going to have to order parts. That said, the plane I am buying has single puck Grove wheels and brakes. I like them but they won't work well with big tires, I can already mash on them as hard as I want without worrying too much about putting the plane on its nose. I have heard but haven't verified that Grove wheels can be used with Cleveland calipers and vice versa.

I'm cheap so I'd go with Grove brakes of the proper rating for the plane. I wish Grove would come out with a 10" wheel.

Evening all, happy thanksgiving eve. I would like to bump this thread with another question. If one is going to run bushwheels, is there any reason to buy tubeless wheels? I understand that the bushwheels are self-contained units without tubes but is there any other reason to have tubeless ready wheelset? Perhaps when running small tires for wheel-skis?

Also, aluminum or magnesium? I would imagine the magnesium is more easily corroded and possibly more brittle.

Treefeller wrote:Evening all, happy thanksgiving eve. I would like to bump this thread with another question. If one is going to run bushwheels, is there any reason to buy tubeless wheels? I understand that the bushwheels are self-contained units without tubes but is there any other reason to have tubeless ready wheelset? Perhaps when running small tires for wheel-skis?

Also, aluminum or magnesium? I would imagine the magnesium is more easily corroded and possibly more brittle.

No need for wheels for tubeless tires in my opinion. About the only tubeless aircraft tires other than Bushwheels are the Goodyear blimp tires, and they work fine on split wheels with 8.50 tubes. If you want to stay with aircraft tires, that is.

Either magnesium or aluminum is fine UNLESS you're going to be in salt water, like on floats or ocean beaches, or possibly based near the coast, in which case I'd stick with aluminum.

MTV

Thank you MTV.

whee wrote:I think Grove does make a quality product but Blackrock has a point, if something fails you are going to have to order parts. That said, the plane I am buying has single puck Grove wheels and brakes. I like them but they won't work well with big tires, I can already mash on them as hard as I want without worrying too much about putting the plane on its nose. I have heard but haven't verified that Grove wheels can be used with Cleveland calipers and vice versa.

I'm cheap so I'd go with Grove brakes of the proper rating for the plane. I wish Grove would come out with a 10" wheel.

Welllll, perhaps I've lived a blessed life, but I've never had a brake problem (other than needing to add a bit of fluid) that wasn't found at routine maintenance. And in that case, having to order a part probably is no big deal.

And as a crusty old mechanic told me during a pre-buy on my first airplane, a stock PA 12 with original brakes, after my comment regarding those brakes: "You're supposed to fly the damned thing, not stop it!"

MTV

If you're going to fly skis and want a smaller tire wheel setup to switch, why not go with the 10 inch wheels and either 29's or 35's , which both need 10 inch wheels... then keep a set of tires on 6 inch wheels for skis..a bit more cash outlay but it's what I did. even though I don't have skis..

One thing to maybe factor in is the fact that although Cleveland wheels and brakes are far and away the benchmark for quality, function and parts are readily had, they are certified parts. This means they will potentially cost several times the amount of the parts you would need to order from Grove (who IMO are just as good).

There is always a trade-off I guess...

Every fall I need to dismount my Airstreaks and put the 6:00's on, in order to utilize my wheel skis. When I put the 'streaks back on in the spring, I of course rotate them, and rotate them "properly", meaning they must be taken off the wheels and turned clear around. Just swapping left and right without dismounting isn't good enough, at least for max wear with these expensive tires.

Getting the tires (the 'streaks) free of the rims has been a struggle, sometimes just dropping it would work, other times extended periods of heavy hammer work didn't do it. Jumping on it didn't do it, I don't have enough ass on me I guess (heard that once from a guy who weighed maybe 350+ lbs, as he was getting on the back of my tractor to act as a counter weight so I could pick a propane tank I was selling him off the ground, the rear tires settled right back down ), this year I finally wised up.

What I needed was a mechanical means to push the tire down, in a controlled fashion, until it popped clear of the rim. I first cogitated over a system using a couple 2x6's hinged to the hangar wall, so I could get some major mechanical leverage. Next the machines the tire shops use came to mind, but then I really wised up and realized I already had the perfect tire changing tool, masquerading as one of the hydraulic stabilizer's on my crane The next time I was at the crane hangar, and while it was warming up prior to heading out to a job, I grabbed one of my dunnage pads and positioned it and the tire directly under the piston and presto, that tire popped right off that rim as slick as could be. The crane has enough ass on it. It was so quick and easy I was sorry I only had 2 to do. So, no more problems dismounting the tires, plus I get to use the crane to make a living, a win/win.