58Skylane wrote:Maybe there can be a way to do an interview process to weed out the Aholes !

I guarantee you that not one single Asshole on this site (or the other) would ever turn anyone in to the Feds. They'd be sitting next to you in the jail cell saying, "Gawddamn that was fun."

Gump

GumpAir wrote:

58Skylane wrote:Maybe there can be a way to do an interview process to weed out the Aholes !

I guarantee you that not one single Asshole on this site (or the other) would ever turn anyone in to the Feds. They'd be sitting next to you in the jail cell saying, "Gawddamn that was fun."

Gump

I guess I should have said "weed out the narcs"!! I guess that makes me an Asshole, because I'd be one of those guys in the jail cell .

Good Call, Zane.

Unfortunate you felt you needed to remove it but thanks for looking out for us.

Whether or not he operated in an unsafe manner, an open discussion is far more valuable to us than having to worry about the Federales breathing down our necks. So shame on those that felt they had to report it.

Craig

This whole episode is a real disappointment, but I will stick around regardless of what is decided. I certainly hope that this will not inhibit the open discussion on this forum, but it will be diffucult to regain trust among the members since everyone will have to be guarded in what they say wondering if there is a snitch. I just don't understand what anyone hoped to gain by calling the feds. Very strange.

Jim

flyin' puncher wrote:This whole episode is a real disappointment, but I will stick around regardless of what is decided. I certainly hope that this will not inhibit the open discussion on this forum, but it will be diffucult to regain trust among the members since everyone will have to be guarded in what they say wondering if there is a snitch. I just don't understand what anyone hoped to gain by calling the feds. Very strange.

Jim

I'll have to agree!! I was going to leave it alone, but the more I read about this latest episode, the more I get irritated with the way alot of people these days are getting into other peoples shit for what ever reason! Case in point, some of you here may know that I drive a tractor trailer for a living and travel all over this country. I can be driving down a desolate highway, 2am in the morning, cruise set at the speed limit (ok, maybe 5 over) (Oh, wait, please don't turn me in to the DOT!!). Minding my own damn business, and then all of a sudden, I'll get some 4 wheeler or even another big rig (I'm not going to single out anyone here) (Damn, I guess I'm breaking the brotherhood of truckers, now) coming up from behind me and either tailgate me or ride along side (mostly 4 wheelers) of me for mile after mile. Or I'll catch up to someone and begin to pass the slower vehicle, then the vehicle I was going to pass speeds up. Sometimes repeating this a few times. What's even more amazing is other vehicles that will come along and cut right in front of a big rig just to get in front of the rig, or just to get off at the next exit. It's just amazing what people do around big semi trucks on the highways these days! I can go on and on with stories, but I'll spare who ever reads this. It's also amazing how many people think that most truck drivers are drug addicts and get hookers every night we stop in the truck stops for the night. Well, I would have to say that is mostly a myth. Sure there are bad apples out there. But you know what? There are bad apples in EVERY industry in this world!! I can say for me (and many 1000's other drivers out there), that I am proud to be a safe professional driver with over a million safe miles driven (one accident to which the driver ran into me at 2am in the morning, interesting story, tell you later). I'm not saying I'm a perfect driver, though. I have had a few speeding tickets over the last 15 years driving cross country. But, I do try hard to roll along and mind my own business and help someone out if I can.

I only "discovered this site a few months ago. It has proven to be a valuable source of information and was of great help in preparing me for my first backcounty trip last month. I even met some people via this site that personally helped my son and I during our time in Idaho and Montana.

I check in here most every day when I am home and enjoy the comments very much. I would like to remain a part of this forum: whatever direction you guys decide to take it.

It is tragic that someone decided to play "informer" and hopefully it will never happen again. Yet...we all have a responsibility to carefully consider what we place into a relatively public site. The FAA never uses a sniper rifle: they just drag out their getto-blaster and innocent colateral damage always occurs.

Big Brother always thinks that we need to be protected from ourselves. Along comes new regulations and restrictions ....further limiting our personal liberties. We should take great care not to draw unecessary attention to ourselves.

Hanger Talk and Campfire Tales are great fun and sources of information. Sometimes however they need to be kept among a very tight "circle of trust." I am not certain that any forum or site can be configured in such a way as to be totally confidential. That is the very reason that I suggested deleting the orginal posting on day one.

Count me in guys and gals. It is my hope to meet many of you one day and to continue to fly freely and accept personal responsibility for the "risks" that I chose to take.

The "government" is not here to help us achive our idea of freedom!

Bob

When my husband told me "the story," I felt it was big of Aktahoe1 to reveal his story with others so they could learn from it. I didn't appreciate the name calling, etc. he was receiving in regards to it. Which one of us has NEVER made a mistake??? (and I'm specifically referring to the person who turned in this guy to the FAA). He was willing to admit his mistake, and I'm sure willing to report it in a timely fashion. No one likes someone who is a tattler (yes, I teach elementary school and we call them tattlers).

In complete agreement with Zane, I'm disappointed as well that one of you guys didn't watch each others backs.

Specifically to the one who did the dastardly deed and lacked the courage to let Aktahoe1 take care of his own business: shame on you- What goes around comes around.

58Skylane,

I will certainly vouch for you about the idiots on the roadways. I drive a lot also and have seen all of the things you described. Some people seem to want to mess with you just for the sake of messing. Can't claim to understand that either. But then, I deal with those kinds of issues on a daily basis and it frustrates the hell out of me, it is so unnecessary.

Jim

I agree 100 percent with you Zane. BCP is a great community and it should be kept that way.

Where I shake my head is a person who goes around "reporting" others for information on a web forum. If a person has direct knowledge and feels the need, well it is what it is; and they still may be wrong for sticking their nose in.

But to get the info off a board and make the call? Not very smart in my opinion. I have been a L.E.O./public safety for nearly 20 years, including a couple with that three letter agency. I would take a dim view of internet hearsay reports. The only exception being an incident of such magnitude/or potential that it must at least be given a cursory exam.

I am 100% for Zane. This is a great site and it wouldn't be the same without it....

Ak I have done a few summers and winters up in AK and without Aviation and people that know how to make it run and fix it when its broke that State would be lost I think.

Thats just my 2 cents!!

Dave

Hi pals, I have been having fun at OSH. I don't know what all this is about but I support you Zane.

Cheers... Rob

wagonwrench wrote:Ak I have done a few summers and winters up in AK and without Aviation and people that know how to make it run and fix it when its broke that State would be lost I think.

And that's another major point of the whole thing. When we read the great tales of the aviation pioneers, both in Alaska and the rest of the world, what captivates us... Stories of how they had annuals signed off properly, or how their mechanic completed a second weight & balance to remove the back seat?

Hell no. It's tales of strong men and fragile machines out there using brains and guts and a whole lotta luck to do something no one had ever done before. Tales of brains, resourcefulness, and courage. The current bunch of whiney bureaucrats and chickenshit tattletales who profess to be so worried about our safety are not cut from the same cloth, and are not in the same class of pilots as far as I'm concerned.

Think one of those old guys would have thought for one second about calling in the government to "return his airplane to service" before he made a field repair himself and flew he and his airplane home to fix it?

Sad damn day it is.

Gump

Amen Gump!

Jim

Hey flyin' puncher. Are you out at the airport west of Las Cruces? I go by there often on I-10 and have stopped by one time (years ago) to look around. I'll have to stop by again sometime. Pat.

58Skylane,

Yessir! PM me and I will give my cell, you can stop in the next time you come through. You can get your truck in here if you drop the trailer, always a hot meal, shower, and a bunk (the RV). If you don't have time for that I can always come down to the truckstop(s) for coffee or something.

I will be starting my busy season in about 30 days and will be pounding I-10 and U.S 60 pretty hard until December (this is why I am looking for a plane).

Jim

Zane titled this and asked "Are we really a community?" ~ and I would say he has his answer... yes ~ you are.

Words are powerful things. The internet and the ability for people to gather in these little boxes and become communities is a wonderful thing; but it's tricky, communicating just by stringing these letters together in these little boxes -- here you have no human contact with each other; no face-to-face interaction; no way to read a response; no ability to read body language; to look a person in the eye; to take a measure of the true intent of their words; to clear up or discuss immediately misunderstanding. You can only try and share thoughts typed through strung together words on a screen and hope they convey what you mean. That's a very difficult thing to do even for someone who does the writing thing for a living.

I watched this entire debacle unfold. Petty and small indeed of whoever reported the incident; "get a life" seems appropriate advice.

But then too ... reasons for everything. It WAS valuable to read the story that started all of this controversy ~ a classic "live and learn" tale that should have been taken in the spirit it was offered. But through this mess, seems you did all learn to perhaps be a bit more cautious in the future about how you maybe word things ~ don't NOT share ~ just keep in mind the potential pitfalls of the medium, and the potential for an anal busy-body to be lurking in the bushes....

More importantly, some lines were drawn in the sand by all of you in regards to what as a majority, you don't want to put up with around here. And Zane I would think got affirmation that what he's created here is a good deal - indeed a community - and worth all the time and effort he's obviously put into it.

Gump, I couldn't agree with you more.

Does the FAA think that if I break down in the middle of no-where, I first need to go through a huge bullshit paper trail and the FAA's blessing before I can takeoff again??? Ya right. I might be dead first, along with my family. You do what you have to do first, deal with the FAA later,..... if you have to. AKtahoe I know some GOOD people in the FAA if you need some help.

As for the guy who turned AKtahoe in,... run and hide , there will be a linch mob of drunk pissed-off pilots after you

Zane,

Great site, I support you and your views 100%. I'll pay in if I have too.

I need another beer!!!!

Zane,

I'm new here, but agree with you 100%. I was taken aback by the name calling - - speaks volumes about the person doing it.

Glad you took the posts off, as I think it counterproductive for anyone to get racked over the coals on this. But don't you think it would be safer to just erase the string, rather than keeping it available to moderators? What would happen if it was subpeaned?

Sorry if someone mentioned this before, but how does anyone know the "snitch" was someone on this site? Didn't AKTahoe1 mention that there was a huge crowd of people watching him at Big Creek, many of whom told him he was in the wrong. Isn't there a U.S. Forest Service Ranger station right there at Big Creek? What about at McCall? How many people where on hand there to watch him taxi out and take off? I have no idea what AKTahoe1's tail number is, but wouldn't be surprised if several government types at Big Creek or McCall had it written down.
My point being that I find it unlikely a fellow GA pilot would turn him in just to spite him, but if someone was on the clock for the government when they witnessed the event, perhaps they would feel it their duty to report it.