Backcountry Pilot • Let the 185 mods begin (again)

Let the 185 mods begin (again)

Have you modified your aircraft? STC? STOL Kit? Major rebuild from just a data plate?
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Tue Jun 23, 2015 7:19 am

Re: Let the 185 mods begin (again)

Barnstormer wrote:
The iPad/iPad-Mini with Foreflight or Garmin Pilot is the best technology by far.



Barnstormer....thanks for the update, keep us posted on how it all works out. To your point above.....agree 100%. Just started going full force with my iPad-mini and foreflight. used it last week in my 185 from Northern California to Houston. Performed flawlessly. Best info upgrade going IMO. Especially since the next newest thing in my panel was made in the Ford Administration (other than the LORAN) :D

Bill
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Tue Jun 23, 2015 7:20 am

Re: Let the 185 mods begin (again)

AK-HUNT wrote:
bat443 wrote:I know that this is going to be an extremely unpopular view on a sight where the MT prop is considered the greatest thing since sliced bread but I find it interesting that the people selling the light weight prop fail to mention that one of the problems is the reduced cranking inertia of the light weight prop compared to the weight the props which were available when the engineers designed the engine. When the engine was designed and the retard of the impulse coupling was determined the engineers took into consideration the available inertia in the prop (read flywheel) to continue rotation of the crankshaft in the correct direction when the first cylinder fires. An engine with a light weight prop requires the starter and thus starter drive to contribute a greater share of that force, possibly more than it is designed for resulting in failure of the starter drive or the starter. I can not say that the sellers of light weight props are aware of this factor, but it is interesting that they say that reducing the timing from 25 to 22 degrees, which has the same effect as increasing the impulse coupling retard by 3 degrees reduces the chance of kickback (reversing of crankshaft direction of rotation). These engines have started fine for decades with inaccurate timing and weak batteries with the old heavy props, and I personally would not want to be dependent on a strong battery and perfect timing when in the back country.

Tim


Maybe the MT is the answer for a lot of guys….but there are always negatives and this one is substantial for some of us. Just something to think about in the "best thing" talk.
Maybe not a big deal for "you" but it is for many of us here.
I'd imagine thats why they aren't hanging on a lot of wagons here.
Cheers,
KA


In the big picture MT has not been around that long. There has been a lot skepticism. I drive around the lake (hood) a couple times a year. Used to not see the MT. Then you would see a couple, now you see a lot. So I just don't agree. But that keeps conversation. The MT is becoming more popular by the day. I truly beat the day lights out of mine and it's tough. There now making the MT with a nickel coated leading edge. That's even tougher than the stainless steal version.

I have also hand propped mine a few times very easily.

Additionally when folks say they question the integrity of the prop...why is almost every cub or lighter aircraft using a Cato or Whirlwind prop? It's the very same technology.

Just my two C.

I also like the fact you can call Neilson and he answers the phone and or calls you back immediately.

AKT
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Tue Jun 23, 2015 10:44 am

Re: Let the 185 mods begin (again)

Tim I can tell you john is aware of the lack of flywheel effect, and in no way tries to hide it, because he recommended the hi torque starter when I bought my prop for that reason. It is the heaviest of the three options from skytec but still much lighter than stock and saving 20 some pounds of prop, plus in my case avoiding an rpm restriction due to harmonics, is well worth it!
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Tue Jun 23, 2015 4:18 pm

Re: Let the 185 mods begin (again)

I was at the husky factory last night, they are pulling off a lot of MT's and replacing them with the new composite hartzel trail blazer or something like that. 80" 2 blade and its lighter than MT's. Don't know if they have something comparable for the 180/185
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Wed Jun 24, 2015 9:46 am

Re: Let the 185 mods begin (again)

Husky must sell a lot of props. A guy at my airport bought a new Husky about 9 years ago, and he's gone through at least 4 props (so far)-- 2 and 3 blade Hartzell, 2 & 3 blade MT, and maybe a Mac or two in between the Hartzells & the MTs.. Every time the Husky factory comes up with the newest best prop", he buys one. Got a 3 blade MT on it now, which makes a really unusual distinctive sound. I always know it's him (or someone else with a 3 blade MT) when I hear it taking off.
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Sun Nov 08, 2015 2:42 pm

Re: Let the 185 mods begin (again)

Okay so I finally decided it was time to go back to 26" Goodyears, after all my manhood is intact with the 35's on the SQ2. While we were in the middle of changing from the 29's back to the 26's Renegade and his much better half drop by for a quick visit. Good to see them both again.

A quick test flight and I have to admit it's nice to be cruising again at 165mph. And she still looks good even in 26's.

Image

The 26's look like tubes for 29's.

Image
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Sun Nov 08, 2015 3:42 pm

Re: Let the 185 mods begin (again)

Looks like you went from hiking boots to loafers. :) bet your loving the extra speed!
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Sun Nov 08, 2015 6:02 pm

Re: Let the 185 mods begin (again)

What's the weight difference between them? I imagine the 26s are heavier?
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Sun Nov 08, 2015 8:29 pm

Re: Let the 185 mods begin (again)

A1Skinner wrote:What's the weight difference between them? I imagine the 26s are heavier?


29" Bushwheel weighs 31lbs, mine were a bit heavier cause I had extra rubber added.

26" Goodyear weighs 23lbs,

8.50x6 tube another pound or two?
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Sun Nov 08, 2015 8:35 pm

Re: Let the 185 mods begin (again)

Barnstormer wrote:
A1Skinner wrote:What's the weight difference between them? I imagine the 26s are heavier?


29" Bushwheel weighs 31lbs, mine were a bit heavier cause I had extra rubber added.

26" Goodyear weighs 23lbs,

8.50x6 tube another pound or two?


Is there an STC for those or field approved?

Bill
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Mon Nov 09, 2015 5:09 am

Re: Let the 185 mods begin (again)

fiftynineSC wrote:Is there an STC for those or field approved?


Field approval.
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Mon Nov 09, 2015 5:42 am

Re: Let the 185 mods begin (again)

Thanks for the quick reply. Love your bird. Looking to do the same eventually, but running the 8.50's for now.
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Mon Nov 09, 2015 8:21 am

Re: Let the 185 mods begin (again)

Barnstormer wrote:
A1Skinner wrote:What's the weight difference between them? I imagine the 26s are heavier?


29" Bushwheel weighs 31lbs, mine were a bit heavier cause I had extra rubber added.

26" Goodyear weighs 23lbs,

8.50x6 tube another pound or two?


Hmm... seems like wishful thinking??? Are you excluding the wheels Phil? If so, I think a better way to talk about it is the NET weight to run a system as some need tubes, some not, some heavy 10" wheels, some 6 etc...

I have been swapping tires a bunch lately. My findings are:

29"s are 42 lbs (this is with wheels, no hubcaps)
8.5x6 are 25lbs. (wheels+tubes/no caps)
8.5x10 Airhawks are 43lbs (10" wheels + tubes)
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Mon Nov 09, 2015 8:26 am

Re: Let the 185 mods begin (again)

The weights are just for the tires (tubes) themselves, and come from the respective websites. I only have one set of 6" wheels so that remains the same whichever tire I install.
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Mon Nov 09, 2015 8:44 am

Re: Let the 185 mods begin (again)

Barnstormer wrote:
fiftynineSC wrote:Is there an STC for those or field approved?


Field approval.


Were any special requirements imposed when said field approval was issued, such 6-bolt wheels + NDT wheel halves and/or gear legs every xyz hours?

I plan on ordering 26-inch tires this month, pending field approval, but would like to provide my local FSDO a reference to forestall transport-category maintenance requirements. I would be much obliged for a copy of the 337 via PM.
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Mon Nov 09, 2015 8:49 am

Re: Let the 185 mods begin (again)

Barnstormer wrote:The weights are just for the tires (tubes) themselves, and come from the respective websites. I only have one set of 6" wheels so that remains the same whichever tire I install.


Makes sense... Thanks Phil.

FWIW... If its helpful to anyone, my weights are actual weights rather than sales figures.
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Mon Nov 09, 2015 9:24 am

Re: Let the 185 mods begin (again)

There's a guy near me who's working on the STC for Goodyear 26's on all Cessna taildraggers. I'll try to find out where he is on the process.
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Mon Nov 09, 2015 10:07 am

Re: Let the 185 mods begin (again)

Be good to hear about that Hammer, I think he would do ok out of it. we don't do field approvals down here so I'd be interested in any STC.
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Mon Nov 09, 2015 10:23 am

Re: Let the 185 mods begin (again)

Hammer wrote:There's a guy near me who's working on the STC for Goodyear 26's on all Cessna taildraggers. I'll try to find out where he is on the process.


When I researched it a bit earlier this year, I was very surprised to find that no one seemed to hold an STC for installing 26" GY's on a C180/185. After all, the 26" GY's were about the only pre-Bushwheel option for tires bigger than 850's, for which there are at least two STC's (North Sound Aviation & Kenmore).

It's about time that someone developed an STC-- I wonder what the price will be. I recall that someone posted that Kenmore's STC for 850's on a 180/185 costs around $300. FWIW Svenns Aviation's STC's for 26" GY's on a Pacer costs $260.
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Mon Nov 09, 2015 11:32 am

Re: Let the 185 mods begin (again)

Great to hear about the STC in the works, Hammer! Always good to have more tire options. Maybe start a dedicated thread on here about it. I'm sure he'll get a lot of interest!
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