zenpilot wrote:
Anyone can bitch on an internet forum Sack up and do something about it.

KW

GumpAir wrote:

the search in Fillmore Ut. I have been involved in many search and rescue efforts in my career and knew of many features available to us which they did not know. After three days and thousands of dollars spent by cap flying around for three days the downed aircraft was found after 15 minutes of searching by the state uhp helicopter. How embarrassing for cap.

I don't know if embarrassed is strong enough of a word.

I can't speak for nowdays, because I don't live there anymore, but it's amazing the difference in how we handled searches in Arctic Alaska back when, compared to what I see down here.

When an aircraft, or snow machine, hunter, boater would be overdue or put out a May Day call, absolutely everything routine in the entire area would come to a screeching halt. Pax on scheduled flights got turned into observers and routes diverted to the search area. Cargo/mail flights were cancelled, and we'd launch full of gas and empty to go look till we'd be on fumes. Every snow machine in the villages would head out to help.

We pushed wx, we flew at night, we nosed into the terrain to get close looks at where people might be, and most of all, we found people quickly. We put airplanes, equipment and people at risk, because it was just a matter of time before one of us doing the looking might be the next one to need the help.

The thought of turning away sets of eyeballs or local knowledge is unthinkable. Down here in Nevada I was at Ground Zero for the Steve Fossett search, which I think was the most expensive search in US history. All I can say is, that it was beyond disgusting watching that comedy play out. Thank goodness it wasn't a search for a family who were in a survivable crash waiting for rescue. Those bloated ego morons wouldn't have found them. And the sad thing is, they would have prevented those who could have from doing it.

Gump

ShysDad wrote:I am going to start making noise again I think. I have a plan, it is silly that it again comes to another families lives ruined. This isnt about flightplans any longer, that stopped after I talked to you guys. This is now about Beacons, PLB's and SAR strategies now. CSStricker, I read your post earlier and I want to say Thank You from the bottom of my heart and soul for looking for my Shyann. If you EVER need anything do not hesitate to ask and I will drop everything to help you my friend. I consider you brother now, you risked your safety for my child and I WILL NEVER FORGET THAT....
Shyann if you are listening pay attention, I am not done fighting for you and others.....Love dad

RanchPilot wrote:

zenpilot wrote:
Anyone can bitch on an internet forum Sack up and do something about it.

KW

GREAT post KW. Thanks for the info.

denalipilot wrote:MTV,

Was that in Alaska? I thought they had their shit together up here a little better than the lower 48 stories we hear.

-DP

M6RV6 wrote:I just called the the IDAHO TRANSPORTATION DEPARTMENT Telephone 208-334-8787 and talked to a MR STAN ETTER who said he was the one who issued the TFR and his major concern was untrained people in Mountainous Terrain and untrained people in search and rescue operations. Also they have had up to 5 aircraft in the area and one was a uh-60 and another was a Lakota and they did not want to have to many aircraft in the area and have another incident or search!
Not that it makes any difference, but I think 2 helo's and 3 fixed wings in that amount of area sure could use some help??

ShysDad wrote:I was doing some research on the missing aircraft this morning and I arrived at a question. Are there any clear protocols that CAP has to follow in regards to a search?.. Here is why I ask this...The search for Shyann allowed no family involvement..no family on ground crews no private aircraft allowed at all. I know because i tried to go in on foot and CAP told me that they would pull out their assets. Now the new search in Idaho allowed 1600 family and church members to participate on the ground crews...1600 are you shitting me? Additionally a private Helo paid for by the family was allowed to be involved in the search. So why the different set of rules? In the search for Shyann, hundreds of people wanted to go in on foot but were not allowed and Pilots for Christ had multiple aircraft on the ground there waiting to be allowed to assist but at first were not allowed at all. Ugh this infuriates me to know end and I will have an answer to this question. So I ask this question: Does CAP make this shit up as they go along or are there standard protocols that must be followed?

ShysDad wrote:I was doing some research on the missing aircraft this morning and I arrived at a question. Are there any clear protocols that CAP has to follow in regards to a search?.. Here is why I ask this...The search for Shyann allowed no family involvement..no family on ground crews no private aircraft allowed at all. I know because i tried to go in on foot and CAP told me that they would pull out their assets. Now the new search in Idaho allowed 1600 family and church members to participate on the ground crews...1600 are you shitting me? Additionally a private Helo paid for by the family was allowed to be involved in the search. So why the different set of rules? In the search for Shyann, hundreds of people wanted to go in on foot but were not allowed and Pilots for Christ had multiple aircraft on the ground there waiting to be allowed to assist but at first were not allowed at all. Ugh this infuriates me to know end and I will have an answer to this question. So I ask this question: Does CAP make this shit up as they go along or are there standard protocols that must be followed?

lowflyinG3 wrote:In reading the Idaho state code on air searches it would appear that at least for Idaho, the Division of Aeronautics plays the dominant role in searches. CAP being a part of the search but under the direction of Aeronautics.

Grassstrippilot wrote:

lowflyinG3 wrote:In reading the Idaho state code on air searches it would appear that at least for Idaho, the Division of Aeronautics plays the dominant role in searches. CAP being a part of the search but under the direction of Aeronautics.

This is correct. I've read many times in the Rudder Flutter (ID Div or Aero publication) that they are primarily responsible. And that's what I don't get. Like I posted earlier, a few years back they were to hold these Safe Pilot meetings and conduct some training for those that want to be volunteer search pilots. On the registration renewal form found on every addition of Rudder Flutter, there is a box to check if you want to be a volunteer pilot. They used to ask for hours and if you had mountain experience. So it seems like they wanted to, or have tried to establish a volunteer system, but I've never heard of people being utilized. Maybe they have and it's just not advertised.

I think Ccstricker might be right. CAP has the manpower, funding, and equipment and are assumed to be the best for the job. As a result, a valuable resource is wasted.