This is one of our Home School Backcountry training strips. I have done this at full fuel (-1/2 hour) and 50 degrees but have reduced my max temps to 46 degrees F. The elevation is just over 5000' and length is 1200'. It is almost totally flat.

The departure end has very thick grass. I have tried several techniques for getting out of here but am open to suggestions, as I would like to be a Bush Pilot someday. Until I finish the 182, I have to make it work with my friend's airplane.

In this footage, I am not getting any acceleration. The little 5's just aren't rolling in the thick frosted grass and it's not a fun feeling. I get the nose wheel out but with 100 hp at this altitude, you just have to be patient.

Richard

That would pucker me up alittle bit . I think the technique looks good, its just hard for those 100 ponies to get that bird up and going. In my opinion it would be alittle too close for comfort for me, but that' just my thoughts.

I'm sure you know this already, but every pound matters. I seldom takeoff with full fuel unless absolutely necessary. I like saving that weight for increased performance. So going with half tanks next time might make a big difference on the takeoff run.

Excellent takeoff getting the nose wheel off as quick as possible and getting into low ground effect as soon as possible and staying in low ground effect as long as possible and turning as necessary to follow the drainage out of the area. The only technique I see a little room for improvement on is staying as low as possible over departure obstructions. You did very well but could have gained a little airspeed by using ten feet over the first little hill rather than taking thirty feet. Finally, I expect you are mentally prepared to put it down on the first hill or between a couple of trees, if there is a power problem. Abort, on this one, would have to come very early in the takeoff run, when your mind is calculating a lot of other factors. After that, you are committed to doing a good job flying to the crash site. Or out, whichever comes first.

There is no way to be sure on the video, but I know you allowed the nose to go down a bit in the turns. You had to. There was no extra power to offset kinetic energy lost due to load factor. So you and the airplane did not allow load factor to be an issue. You did nothing with the stick, and the airplane lowered it's nose just enough to prevent load factor. This is what you have learned from experience, unfortunately it is seldom taught, and what the airplane was designed to do.

Yikes! That's dancing a little close to the flames, at least it is for me. Looks like the angle of attack is a bit much early on, but it worked.

Time to finish the 182.

Cool! Reminds me of my 120 flyin days.
Yeah it's close but no different hen all the other max performance takeoffs we see from Cubs and 180 and everything else. Maybe the only difference is they climb.

That looked perfect to me. The ONLY thing that will make it perform better are stol kit, bigger tires, better prop, and so on. If you have a 182 focus those dollars on that.

I have an effective method to reduce your takeoff distance at that strip. Go rent a riding lawnmower and spend some quality time in that grass!

If you can get permission to put larger tires on the 150, this also might be worthwhile.

A few years back, Continental put out an AD or service bulletin to retard the ignition timing a few degrees. This is definitely not helping your takeoff performance, and it seems like you could use every little bit of help you can get. So if your magnetos accidentally slipped back to the old 1960's era setting, and you always use 100LL fuel and are flying at cooler temperatures, you might see an increase in power.

A low-resistance air filter, perfectly clean and gapped plugs, and other "tune-up" type of maintenance is probably worthwhile.

Id say, you couldn't have done any better with what you got, good thing it was cool out. Very cool strip, but get rid of those bushes at the end. It will increase your margin substantially.

If that is all bush and no little hill, change my ten feet clearance recommendation to one inch.

According to C-150 PoH manuals I see on the web, the ground run at that altitude and temperature is pretty much pushing the limits of that 1200 ft runway. A good headwind is a big help.

If the runway can be mowed or otherwise fixed up so you don't have to treat it as a "soft field" I suspect that would help some. That would allow you to dispense with the 10 degree of flaps and pulling that nose off the ground for a good portion of the ground run - according to the PoH those drag things out - their only advantage is they get you into ground effect where the induced lift drag is presumably lower than the rolling friction drag of the wheels on a "soft field" - but if the field weren't soft they wouldn't get you up over obstacles any quicker.

Actually getting the nose wheel off as soon as possible and getting the mains off as soon as possible and staying in ground effect as long as possible will increase acceleration on any surface. Airplanes were not designed to roll on the ground and they don't do it very well. Airplanes were designed to fly and they do it very well. After about fifty thousand takeoffs doing the above on all surfaces, I can guarantee you acceleration in low ground effect is far more effective than staying on the ground until Vx or Vy. Also clearing obstructions as low as possible gives the best possibility of clearing the obstruction without mushing. Mowing the field will help. Paving it will help more. But staying on the grass, dirt, or pavement any longer than necessary is unproductive.

+1

Good to see that little C150 being flown by someone who has it dialed in.

Gump

Yeah, Gump. And when richpiney gets his 182 finished, he will know how to fly it.

Yeah he will, and I have a feeling he is going to join the ranks actual pilots on here, and not be just a guy in an airplane manipulating controls. It'll be fun to watch.

Gump

My observations, for what it's worth:

In the video, there's a statement that you've dropped 20 flaps. The 1968 150's manual doesn't describe any more than 10 flaps for any take off. More than 10 adds unnecessary aerodynamic drag without providing any significant lift over 10 degrees deflection, and it actually makes it harder to raise the nose. I know that it's common in the back country to "pop" the flaps down to break free and get into the air, then raise the flaps to 10 right away, but unless you have manual flaps, it's not practical. It's been a lot of years since I last flew a 150, but my recollection is that the electric flaps don't move very fast.

On raising the nose, the video also shows that you've raised the nose more than necessary to get it out of the grass. If you can raise it so that it just clears the grass, you'd have a lower angle of attack and consequently less aerodynamic drag. You'll get the mains out of the grass actually quicker with a little less angle of attack, because you'll be able to accelerate faster.

The best part of the video shows that you kept it very low, in ground effect, to gather more airspeed--that's excellent. Absolutely, it's true that the airplane will accelerate faster in the air than on the ground, and much faster in ground effect than if the airplane is allowed to climb out of ground effect. But I think you'd accelerate faster, if you only had 10 flaps in instead of 20.

Cary

Cary, using over 10 degrees isn't going to help for rotating and climb out of ground effect. But, if your plan is to get off the ground into ground effect, and stay there..... Then popping in 20, 30, or even 40 degrees works to get the wheels off the ground way better than 0 or 10. Drag is not the issue in using ground effect to accelerate for take-off, it's just like using 40 degrees and slowing down way below Vso for short field work. it gets, or keeps, you in the air way slow, and from there you do what you need to do.

Go try it in your Cessna at different flap settings up to full flaps, but don't climb more than a foot or two, and work the wheels off the ground. You may be surprised to find that big flap coming down just levitates the airplane way below flying speed.

Of course weight, DA, winds, and terrain all have to factor in too. Some days best thing is just have another beer, and wait till things look better.

Gump

Using some extra flap to get those little tires off the teeth-rattling surface sooner is always preferable. It's easier on the airframe in the long run too.

if there is actually real heavy frost on the grass it will help to taxi back and forth a few times to break down the frozen grass, then make the takeoff run in your tracks. I might not seem like this would make much difference but a few billion grass blades that won't bend over create a lot of drag.

Wow! You must have ninja flying chops! Looks like a really cool strip...Is it private? I'd love to try it one day but it's probably beyond my expertise. I've been told donuts and a gallon of chocolate milk delivered go a long ways toward gaining use of private strips.

You should cut those bushes down for sure... I bet the neighbors wouldn't care at all. I also noticed there were a few tall trees on the opposite end that would help with the approach from that direction. Maybe you should cut those down too. I really like the dog leg at the beginning of your takeoff roll. I wonder if I could get my 180 in there. Very good job!