piperpainter wrote:If the weather is good I'll def be coming up this next sat! But it doesn't look promising.....so maybe another weekend!

I just have to be honest Brian-

I like that Mooney and the places you take it. The ice is much different. Pressure ridges, soft spots, etc. That Mooney is not built like the 206 (the only nose dragger out there). You have a problem on that ice with your beautiful bird and we wont be flying on the ice any longer. Thats honest. (that goes for all of us, but we have the planes for it) I dont want to come off as dick here, and I know your going to disagree but, its only a matter of time before that nose gear goes out or the retract gear folds. I live in a lot of aspects of my life by a moto that is simple..."Its not a matter of if, but when, and when is not an option".

I know you like taking that plane into places that no Mooney driver will, and you have a lot of respect for that from many of the folks here on the board including myself. But again, if that gear goes out on the ice, Soldier bar, a muddy lake bed, etc., its going to effect a lot of folks. There is a big picture.

The way you like to fly, get a plane thats built for it. I just dont want to see you get yourself in a booger man.

Please dont hold this post against me...

AKT

Just wondering... What would happen if you hit a lil snow drift up there in a TW plane on wheels (or even ski's). You know as well as I how flat light can make it look smooth as silk then suddenly, wham, 2' high ridge good bye gear legs and you get to stress test the shoulder harness.

3 weeks ago I landed a lake on ski's that I had drug 4 times before I set down, looked flat as could be. After landing the only thing that was flat was my tail spring and my back bone from the snow drift that I could not see at all until I was mere feet from it. How I didnt fold the mail gear or buckle the fuse is beyond me.

My point is, how would one type of aircraft having and incident change it any at all from another type of aircraft? That Sea Rey is not known for having the worlds strongest gear legs, yet he was cool to be up there playing.

Again, not trying to pick a fight here, was just wondering. What would be the diff in MM and his Stinson going for a ride on a strip in ID and PP folding up a gear on the same strip, other than the feds drug testing PP for taking that mooney into the places that he does LOL.

Great pics, looks like a total blast and my kind of flying! Hope the snow up here gets better for you as most of the mountains I ride in the area are showing EXTREME avy danger!

The main difference is that I have landed these first with skis on. Your correct about the ballIng of an aircraft. Brian is a very good pilot in his Mooney! I am willing to bet however a Stinson, cub, cessna etc., going somewhere getting crunched is much different than a low wing nose dragger getting crunched in the Feds mind. Maybe not and not really my point.

People can land where they choose as PIC... I just don't want to be part of it.

aktahoe1 wrote:its going to effect a lot of folks. There is a big picture.

We all love Piperpainter, but this is a very good point. Your buddies aren't going to leave you behind if you are stranded, but it's also unfair to burden them with the increased probability of a situation.

It's not much different than having a tiny-tired (but large penised?) friend accompany you into places you've chosen because you have 31" bushwheels.

aktahoe1 wrote:

piperpainter wrote:If the weather is good I'll def be coming up this next sat! But it doesn't look promising.....so maybe another weekend!

I just have to be honest BrYan-

I like that Mooney and the places you take it. The ice is much different. Pressure ridges, soft spots, etc. That Mooney is not built like the 206 (the only nose dragger out there). You have a problem on that ice with your beautiful bird and we wont be flying on the ice any longer. Thats honest. (that goes for all of us, but we have the planes for it) I dont want to come off as dick here, and I know your going to disagree but, its only a matter of time before that nose gear goes out or the retract gear folds. I live in a lot of aspects of my life by a moto that is simple..."Its not a matter of if, but when, and when is not an option".

I know you like taking that plane into places that no Mooney driver will, and you have a lot of respect for that from many of the folks here on the board including myself. But again, if that gear goes out on the ice, Soldier bar, a muddy lake bed, etc., its going to effect a lot of folks. There is a big picture.

The way you like to fly, get a plane thats built for it. I just dont want to see you get yourself in a booger man.

Please dont hold this post against me...

AKT

No hate!!
The Mooney Gear is much tougher than many people think! Especially given the fact that it's a trailing gear. This seems much better than the strut that points out front if you ask me. It'll compress and spring right back as it rolls over an object! Also I am not about to land on any lake that has a layer of snow that would effect me. If it was thick ice with a thin layer of snow 2-3 inches I wouldn't be worried if i knew it was thick enough.

Anyway, no worries! I don't hold it against you at all!

Speaking of "ice ridges," has anyone ever seen sastrugi up close? Rougher 'n a cob. Nasty. I'd hate to find some of it lurking under a blanket of fresh powder. Well, I have, on man-skis...not with an airplane.

yes I have, that is what kicked my ass a few weeks ago. That was hidden under a nice 4" layer of super fluffy powder. As soon as I slowed down n the skis sunk in it was a nasty ass ride! Glad I beefed up the fuse at the gear attach points and put the heavy duty gear on.

I guess the 80 MPH winds a few weeks before I was there should have been a clue, but most of the lakes had been swept clean of all traces of snow prior to the latest 4" we had gotten the night before. I guess I got lucky and found the wrong lake.

FWIW, That is whats going on right now here at work. All the drill sites are blown in and roads are impassible with drifts looking just like those in your picture blocking in the roads from 2-6' deep.

A couple years ago I had to take the snowmachines out on the tundra to inspect a pipeline and dont ever want to do that again. May as well have been riding broken concrete with no suspension! That crap is ROUGH!!

Some fresh ski-plane and heli-assisted skiing stoke, with some cool history to boot. Check out that super cub landing on the ridge!

Awesome video, Oregon180! Thanks for posting it.

Leave it to a bush pilot to "pioneer" something............. Who woulda thought???? Haha. Sweet video.

Awesome Video!!!! thanks Oregon180!!!

Hey Kevin (and others?): I had just begun taxi-testing new wheel penetration skis on my Rans S7. During one of the turns in heavyish powder, I could hear the prop encounter the snow. During the turn I raised the tail to near level attitude in an attempt to pull the tailwheel (no ski) out of the snow to facilitate the turn. Do you ever "hear" the prop impact the snow? If so, is there anything to worry about? I checked my Kiev prop and it is fine, but still can't help but wonder what I'm stressing in the Rotax slipper clutch/gear box. I have vowed to keep things as tail-low as possible from now on...

I'm having fun just skiplane-mobiling (several weeks of lake-effect induced IFR), can't wait to actually get off the ground and land somewhere

Thanks for putting this thread together; we're all learning a ton and enjoying the HD pics.

Great piece of ski history Oregon180. Way cool! Thanks for posting.

dayooper wrote:Hey Kevin (and others?): I had just begun taxi-testing new wheel penetration skis on my Rans S7. During one of the turns in heavyish powder, I could hear the prop encounter the snow. During the turn I raised the tail to near level attitude in an attempt to pull the tailwheel (no ski) out of the snow to facilitate the turn. Do you ever "hear" the prop impact the snow? If so, is there anything to worry about? I checked my Kiev prop and it is fine, but still can't help but wonder what I'm stressing in the Rotax slipper clutch/gear box. I have vowed to keep things as tail-low as possible from now on...

I'm having fun just skiplane-mobiling (several weeks of lake-effect induced IFR), can't wait to actually get off the ground and land somewhere

Thanks for putting this thread together; we're all learning a ton and enjoying the HD pics.

It is not uncommon to chew up a little snow. Fresh powder isnt too bad but when you start sucking up chunks of the crusty stuff our composite props don't like it too much. Do yourself a HUGE favor, if your planning on doing a lot of ski flying, get a tail ski! They really do make a huge difference.

Always like to see the TGR crew and early Valdez getting some action! Actually flew with Chuck in 91 on Thompson Pass in the beaver there. That was back when heli rides to the surrounding peaks were $25. We would purchase 4 rides, heli (poker) chips for a C note. Crazy how times have changed.

Just a couple photos to keep this going until our weather improves around here.
Side Slip to a fun spot


3 sets of tracks



And some good ski flying porn
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o29wAHrOJRQ
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wzDf5wRyKDU
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cAcocdKzqTA

And I got a little side tracked...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2NvLqwjNr94

AKT

akavidflyer wrote:

dayooper wrote:Hey Kevin (and others?): I had just begun taxi-testing new wheel penetration skis on my Rans S7. During one of the turns in heavyish powder, I could hear the prop encounter the snow. During the turn I raised the tail to near level attitude in an attempt to pull the tailwheel (no ski) out of the snow to facilitate the turn. Do you ever "hear" the prop impact the snow? If so, is there anything to worry about? I checked my Kiev prop and it is fine, but still can't help but wonder what I'm stressing in the Rotax slipper clutch/gear box. I have vowed to keep things as tail-low as possible from now on...

I'm having fun just skiplane-mobiling (several weeks of lake-effect induced IFR), can't wait to actually get off the ground and land somewhere

Thanks for putting this thread together; we're all learning a ton and enjoying the HD pics.

It is not uncommon to chew up a little snow. Fresh powder isnt too bad but when you start sucking up chunks of the crusty stuff our composite props don't like it too much. Do yourself a HUGE favor, if your planning on doing a lot of ski flying, get a tail ski! They really do make a huge difference.

Akaavidflyer: Thanks for the reply! I am indeed working on getting a tail ski fabricated. Amazing how much prop to ground freeboard you lose going from 26" Airstreaks to skis. Then throw in the fact that the skis sink 6" or more in powder and that prop clearance gets further reduced 46" of lake effect snow in last 11 days

The Roberts gear mod gets the prop about 5" higher, I never hit the snow. Datum sells a slick wheel penetration tail ski that works great with the 8" Matco TW.

courierguy wrote:The Roberts gear mod gets the prop about 5" higher, I never hit the snow. Datum sells a slick wheel penetration tail ski that works great with the 8" Matco TW.

Yeah, kind of wish now I went with the Roberts gear before rigging skis. Took Trickair nearly 3 months to have a bracket fabricated for the existing gear legs. Figure I'll ride out this season on the conventional legs.

I've gotten a quote for the Datum tail ski, and could get in short order, however found someone in WI who is willing to fabricate one at half the cost for the 8" Matco TW. We're hoping Randy might consider letting him borrow a fork to fabricate from (I can't afford to ship mine down). But this is taking longer than anticipated to get resolved So may have to bite the bullet and get the Datum! Thanks for reply Tom.