about the only thing you can really work on. with a paved runway for short/soft field training is short field, unless you use the grass between the runway and taxiway. which is not always possible, My $.02

One of my first soft field takeoffs shocked me. I was holding the nose off but I could not get the plane to accelerate. Luckily it wasn't too short of a field. Talked to a pilot afterward who does lots of this stuff and he had me drop the nose gear to just skim during the takeoff roll. At least in a PA-22 the full aft elevator leads to so much aerodynamic drag that in real world soft field with the addition of rolling drag it can hardly achieve needed takeoff acceleration.

I agree with Cary on the trim. I never used trim because I almost never made long climbs or long descents. Also, the trim for cruise is the same for full flaps in Cessnas. I always use full flaps. I just leave the trim alone.

Troy Hamon wrote:One of my first soft field takeoffs shocked me. I was holding the nose off but I could not get the plane to accelerate. Luckily it wasn't too short of a field. Talked to a pilot afterward who does lots of this stuff and he had me drop the nose gear to just skim during the takeoff roll. At least in a PA-22 the full aft elevator leads to so much aerodynamic drag that in real world soft field with the addition of rolling drag it can hardly achieve needed takeoff acceleration.

That's interesting Troy. To this point I have been holding aft or near-aft elevator to "protect" the nose gear. I'll give your technique a shot.

Hold elevator to get the nose off, then relax back pressure gradually to allow the nose to just drop down to the point of touching but very light. Makes a big difference. The faster you go the less aft the elevator needs to be to keep it light.

ExperimentalAviator wrote:It was probability his first real soft field op

i agree, and if so, thinking.... the guy should have had a beer, praised his god that he didnt flip the plane when dropping it in there, then paid some real jack to someone who has real experience in real soft fields to take off and ferry to a real airport. he might still have a real ride

We have covered two 182 accidents recently where no attempt was made to achieve a pressure airspeed sufficient to control the aircraft safely in low ground effect. I expect every instructor here has experienced similar pitched up too soon events in less powerful airplanes. What Patrick is covering in his approach series is not just important for backcountry work. The basic low ground effect takeoff technique will not be there when needed if it is not used except in tight situations.

contactflying wrote:We have covered two 182 accidents recently where no attempt was made to achieve a pressure airspeed sufficient to control the aircraft safely in low ground effect. I expect every instructor here has experienced similar pitched up too soon events in less powerful airplanes. What Patrick is covering in his approach series is not just important for backcountry work. The basic low ground effect takeoff technique will not be there when needed if it is not used except in tight situations.

In the other 182 accident with the patients on board, the plane appeared to be overloaded, it actually looked as if it was possibly way out of the aft cg limit. In this situation, the tail might not have enough power to get the nose down. In the cornfield accident, the accident report states that the pilot was the sole occupant, so who knows what went wrong there.

contactflying wrote:We have covered two 182 accidents recently where no attempt was made to achieve a pressure airspeed sufficient to control the aircraft safely in low ground effect. I expect every instructor here has experienced similar pitched up too soon events in less powerful airplanes. What Patrick is covering in his approach series is not just important for backcountry work. The basic low ground effect takeoff technique will not be there when needed if it is not used except in tight situations.

Us Maule drivers know what the real problem is. It is those dangerous Cessnas. LOL