Stene's instructions say 15lbs. I'm gonna do a real W&B soon to figure out what I actually gained with the bushwheels/tailwheel/stol kit.

lesuther wrote:
Did you find the pitch was less nose-heavy, or more nose-heavy?

Droop leading edge cuff means more overall camber, which would make it reasonably probable to see more nose-down pitching moment out of the wing, which would make it reasonably more probable to run out of evevator faster, or need more elevator authority to flare/rotate. VG's on the bottom of the stabilizer (like what they specify with the wing VG's) would probably help that a little, assuming it was not too illegal or immoral to put them on.

On my 172 after the Sportsman cuff was installed, I needed more nose down trim in cruse, at lower speeds, landing, I found that the aircraft was far more power to pitch sensitive than before and required less trim in order to control pitch angle if I need to go around.

Those Clecos look like they'd add a lot of drag!

Very nice, Rob. It sounds like it's going to be well worth the money.

Droop leading edge cuff means more overall camber, which would make it reasonably probable to see more nose-down pitching moment out of the wing, which would make it reasonably more probable to run out of evevator faster, or need more elevator authority to flare/rotate. VG's on the bottom of the stabilizer (like what they specify with the wing VG's) would probably help that a little, assuming it was not too illegal or immoral to put them on.

does anyone know if you can use the combination of VG"s and a sportsman stol cuff???

Absolutley you can. Do a search there has been a lot of discussion about this already. Check the skywagon forums too. I'm not sure if it is worth it or not though... Maybe for the tail it would be nice?

Yes you can I have had the sportsman on my 170 for a few years now ang installed VGs the other day. the sportsman is great and well worth the money, the VGs are less money and dont make as drastic of difference as the sportsman but they do make a noticeable improvement and are a great mod as they ad almost no weight are relatively affordable and make a safer airplane.

Are them guys good enough to get 'em on a 48 ragwing.

Sweet ride


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk because I'm still working and can't get my damned aircard connected.

I have a 182 P with Sportsman and VGs, and its really awesome, totally recommended mods.
Will post a few videos later.
If you want this mods to work, get rid of the flap gap seals.

Rob
Good review', I'm glad you like it.Sounds like your getting about the same performance I'm getting with my 170.Your going to like it at altitude also as long as you have that 80-42 out front of you sucking air.
Did you install airleon gap seals also?you probally did.
John

Yeah I put the aeileron gap seals in also. No flap gap seals, I've flown with them and don't like them.

Nice!!

Aileron gap seals are part of the stc I believe. Flap gap seals are unrelated. ccurrie's has the flap gap seals but he has never had it without them so don't know the difference. I suspect the flaps would be a little more effective without them.

Very cool! I put Sportsman on my 180 last year. Similar experience--approach at 60 (mph not knots) felt more solid than the former 70. Then I did Wing-X too... Still getting used to flying approach speeds at 50 or even lower. I was flying around at altitude this last weekend proving to myself yet again that it flies just fine at 1400 rpm and 40 mph, and when the wing finally does give out in the high 30s (IAS) it is such a gentle event and just a bit of extra power solves that problem.

I just wish I could do VGs just on the tail, to help it catch up with the wing. Don't really want them on the wing.

Have fun!

I am new to the flying game and the 170B I purchased had the sportsman's cuff and flap gap seals.I put about 40 hours on the plane then added the VG's. I could most certainly tell the VG's added slow flight control and improved Vx and Vy. My question is aimed at the flap gap seals. Most posts don't like them. Why? My airplane flies great and the other people who have flown it agree. I know I have very little experience (<100hrs) but are those flap gap seals holding back the real potential?

Get rid of the flap gap seals if you want to take full advantage of your STOL kit.
Makes the flaps more effective.
My plane had Horton STOL, VGs and flap gap seals.
I approached for short fields at 60mph, and it felt like sinking under me.

Changed to Sportsman , added the VGs again and got rid of the flap gap seals and short field approaches are at 50 mph IAS.(no sink)
I have 50 pounds in the cargo compartment to have a more neutral CG(helps a lot), dont think the 170 is as nose heavy as the 182 so probably doesnt need it.

See the difference between the stock wing and the Sportsman cuff.
Make sure you re adjust your stall warning.

wtxdragger wrote: Are them guys good enough to get 'em on a 48 ragwing. ............

If you're talking about VG's-- yes, Micro finally got them approved for the ragwing 170 several years ago. I owned one for many years, and never realized until I bought my 150 just how lazy the 170 ailerons are. If the VG's noticably livened them up, they might be a worthwhile addition.
I did add a set to my 150 recently-- it already had great aileron response and I didn't see much improvement there or in the stall speed department. They did seem to improve the low-speed rudder a bit more. Kinda wish I've saved my money for gas but now I know.

motoadve,

I am wondering why you switched from the Horton stol kit to the Sportsman? I have the Horton stol kit on my 180hp 170b - no flap gap seals, and not ever flying one with the sportsman kit I would be interested in the difference. I fly approaches to short dirt strips in the 50-55 mph indicated range and it doesn't feel like it's falling out underneath me. But again, I've never been in a 170 with the sportsman or the normal wing, so I may just be ignorant of the difference.

The Horton STOl kit makes a very small difference compared with the camber cuff of post 1972 182's is just a small change in the wing, the Sportsmans is a big change, adds wing area too and the cuff is more pronounced.

I read the 170 is the model that gets the most benefit of the Sportsman STOL kit.
The 182 is heavier than the 170 so thats why you approach at those speeds with no problem with the Horton.
Go for the Sportsman , in my plane it made a big difference.
you will love it!

From everything I've read or heard from people the Horton is good but the Sportsman is just better. That's why you will see people removing the Horton and installing the Sportsman but never the other way around. Look at the difference in the leading edge profile:
There is a lot more to it than the other kits. It was designed by a Lockheed Skunkworks engineer and tested in wind tunnels, not sure about the Horton. And as motoadve said it adds wing area. Stene Aviation just came out with a new wingtip design also which adds even more wing area than before (which I have on my plane). According to them, the cuff and wing tips add nearly 9sq.ft. to the 170 wing.