Zzz wrote:Always interesting to see what gets people to post. If this started as a question, it would be Cunningham's Law exemplified. How long until we achieve Godwin's Law?

I wish there was as much enthusiasm for writing original, creative stories for this site.

Wish I had your wit in writing.LOL I can barely put together a grammatically correct sentence.

Anyways here it goes……….I do watch DG’s or the Blanco videos albeit skipping thru to find the highlights I need to do my own research. Whether they are tools or not, their info gives a good place to start. Kinda like being lazy (according to my copilots I am) and not doing the initial research and stealing someone else’s report and using their bibliography. Do they jump the gun with “possible” assumptions, yes. I feel they do but it’s something to ponder till the eons pass and the NTSB posts their questionable info. Even though some of the these guys videos are …….grating so to speak. I can always choose not to watch.

These aviation YouTube “tools” sometimes trigger the Monday morning quarterbacking that gets many a useful discussion on online sites from people that do have real world experience. Even though I have experience with the DHC-2 I had no idea of the Otter issue and frankly find it interesting even though I’ll never operate one.

TVATIVAK71 wrote:

NineThreeKilo wrote:

slow18 wrote:There’s an avweb article. That doesn’t scream credibility to me.

https://www.avweb.com/news/pilot-arrest ... -incident/

What does that have to do with anything?


What points in the video I linked to did you take issue with and why?


Seriously this is like talking to some high school girls, you want to base your opinions on a ton of unchecked emotion and how popular the speaker is????

no bueno

Not a fan of DG but I do glean a informative morsel from him now and again. Its just perspective as with all the YouTube experts and how you take it is up to you. I’m just not a fan of his delivery. Blanco? pretty much spews the same info as DG but his delivery is much more…….humble than the other guy. Is DG right on his assumptions?…anyone can research what he did on a internet search engine and come up with the same conclusion. We may never know what happened.

You seem like a well informed aviation professional and enthusiast but your delivery is condescending and reeks of ego. It seems to piss you off when a person (some cases “maybe” wanna be expert at a keyboard) disagrees with your opinion. If you have that much accomplishment and knowledge then it should be no problem to state your opinion and leave it at that. Should have no problem saying DILLIGAF at an opposing post and move on. I was raised with big egos and have one as well…..that’s what I do.


Amusing reading the back and forth here thou.

I’m 1000% for debating the facts, that’s how we grow, now when someone won’t listen to some good points because of some emotional thing I just don’t get that especially in our industry.

I don’t think I would go camping with most any of those YouTube types, well minus a few of the hot chicks, but if someone has some good logical explanations I could HAAATTTEEEE them and I’d still get the info out of the video

Let’s disagree, bounce ideas on how to make things better, but putting ones fingers in one’s ears because you don’t personally like someone, meh

mtv wrote:

TangoFox wrote:

mtv wrote:So, are you guys actually interested in what happened in that event, or just what your hero Gryder THINKS happened?

MTV

Do tell.
I do want to know.
What happened???

Don't ask me....I'm waiting for someone who actually knows something to try and figure it out. And, that's not going to happen until or unless they actually recover that airplane.

So, lob a few more insults out there if it makes you feel superior.....

MTV

What insults?? You as far as I can tell are the one lobbing insults as usual.
You call Gryder my hero??
I hadn't heard of the guy until you started saying how terrible he was on this thread.
Then I watched the video and it does sound plausible.
You go bashing anyone who says "hey Maybe??"
You say whatever Gryder says is wrong because you don't like him????
Well here is your big chance. go ahead and tell us if he can't be right then you with all of your superior knowledge must have a guess as to what could have happened.
If you say you don't know then does that mean you actually think he could possibly be right be right but your ego won't let you admit it?
What if the NTSB comes out and says Elevator/Trim issues?
Then would you agree with Gryder?
Or would you claim that Gryder is their Hero and that their findings couldn't be right because you have no use for Gryder?

TangoFox wrote:

mtv wrote:

TangoFox wrote:

mtv wrote:So, are you guys actually interested in what happened in that event, or just what your hero Gryder THINKS happened?

MTV

Do tell.
I do want to know.
What happened???

Don't ask me....I'm waiting for someone who actually knows something to try and figure it out. And, that's not going to happen until or unless they actually recover that airplane.

So, lob a few more insults out there if it makes you feel superior.....

MTV

What insults?? You as far as I can tell are the one lobbing insults as usual.
You call Gryder my hero??
I hadn't heard of the guy until you started saying how terrible he was on this thread.
Then I watched the video and it does sound plausible.
You go bashing anyone who says "hey Maybe??"
You say whatever Gryder says is wrong because you don't like him????
Well here is your big chance. go ahead and tell us if he can't be right then you with all of your superior knowledge must have a guess as to what could have happened.
If you say you don't know then does that mean you actually think he could possibly be right be right but your ego won't let you admit it?
What if the NTSB comes out and says Elevator/Trim issues?
Then would you agree with Gryder?
Or would you claim that Gryder is their Hero and that their findings couldn't be right because you have no use for Gryder?

Groan….

Done here. All I’m saying is I’m not about to speculate on this accident. There are no “ facts” about THIS accident being offered here, just pure speculation.

I’ve seen too many of these that turned out to be quite different than the speculation suggested. And, yes, a few where the speculation was more or less correct.

I choose not to speculate. That’s all.

MTV

mtv wrote:Groan….

Done here. All I’m saying is I’m not about to speculate on this accident. There are no “ facts” about THIS accident being offered here, just pure speculation.

I’ve seen too many of these that turned out to be quite different than the speculation suggested. And, yes, a few where the speculation was more or less correct.

I choose not to speculate. That’s all.

MTV

But that’s all the NTSB does is speculation

No comment on tail feather corrosion or what we could do better to mitigate, comparisons to the other crashes?

Couldn’t we speak of things here and maybe spread some knowledge?

[quote="mtv"]....I'm waiting for someone who actually knows something to try and figure it out. And, that's not going to happen until or unless they actually recover that airplane....../quote]

The local news is reporting that the airplane has been located.
It's in deep, current-y water, so diving is problematic.
They're apparently planning on recovering it using remotely operated equipment.
Then off to a hangar somewhere to dissect it and analyze WTF happened.

hotrod180 wrote:

mtv wrote:....I'm waiting for someone who actually knows something to try and figure it out. And, that's not going to happen until or unless they actually recover that airplane....../quote]

The local news is reporting that the airplane has been located.
It's in deep, current-y water, so diving is problematic.
They're apparently planning on recovering it using remotely operated equipment.
Then off to a hangar somewhere to dissect it and analyze WTF happened.

West coast gets deep quick

I think we can discuss possibilities without speculating. I for one am constantly learning through this process - and since I'd like to maybe fly a turbine otter some day, I find it helpful.

Gryder might be right, even a broken clock is right twice a day. After watching his video on this topic, I only really learned that he is somewhat capable of using the googles. I've seen him be wrong about a good many other issues though, so I don't claim him as a hero and will not subscribe to his channel.... and kick myself each time I give him a click.

soyAnarchisto wrote:I think we can discuss possibilities without speculating. I for one am constantly learning through this process - and since I'd like to maybe fly a turbine otter some day, I find it helpful.

Gryder might be right, even a broken clock is right twice a day. After watching his video on this topic, I only really learned that he is somewhat capable of using the googles. I've seen him be wrong about a good many other issues though, so I don't claim him as a hero and will not subscribe to his channel.... and kick myself each time I give him a click.

^^^^^^^^
Yes DG is a loud mouthed tool. If he does some research in order to gain some respect from the aviation crowd, great. We might learn something. I’ll check to see if Juan Brown has covered it first, I’ll click if no second option (Juan is an off-road cross country motorcycle junkie like me).

I think everyone on this site is smart enough to decipher fact from fiction.

I was reading something about the turbine converted DHC3 requiring a extra push/pull rod in Canadia?

NineThreeKilo wrote:I was reading something about the turbine converted DHC3 requiring a extra push/pull rod in Canadia?

You were? Where was this tidbit written up? Which push/pull rod was doubled?

There's at least 4 different engine conversions for the DHC-3 including the 1000hp PZL radial, Garret straight turbine, and PT-6, and Walter (GE) free turbines. All of them require some different combination of airframe modifications and instrumentation/limitations. I'd be curious which one required an extra push/pull rod.

slow18 wrote:There’s an avweb article. That doesn’t scream credibility to me.

https://www.avweb.com/news/pilot-arrest ... -incident/

Wow....
Not exactly circumspect

Halestorm wrote:

NineThreeKilo wrote:I was reading something about the turbine converted DHC3 requiring a extra push/pull rod in Canadia?

You were? Where was this tidbit written up? Which push/pull rod was doubled?

There's at least 4 different engine conversions for the DHC-3 including the 1000hp PZL radial, Garret straight turbine, and PT-6, and Walter (GE) free turbines. All of them require some different combination of airframe modifications and instrumentation/limitations. I'd be curious which one required an extra push/pull rod.

Saw it here


“ Reading a bit about the AD that applies. It appears that the initial AD was released that required an additional push / pull rod on the servo tab (not the flap system connected tab) applicable to the Vazar (PT6), Garrett, GE / Walter and PZL recip STC'd aircraft. Later it appears that that requirement was dropped on the Garrett and GE / Walter STC'd aircraft. At least this is what it seems from what I can glean from a perusal of internet available info. Is there an AME or other person knowledgeable about this AD and its history that an chime in with the straight skinny?

https://www.federalregister.gov/documen ... -airplanes

Of course this may all be a pig in a poke since at the moment they have yet to even locate any wreckage let alone look over any of it. Truth is it will be months before it gets beyond unsupported speculation. ”



“ It would probably depend on whether the Walther STC / installation was accomplished before or after it was exported to the US. Also whether it was installed in either Canada or the US whether the version of the AD was current that rescinded the requirement for incorporating the 2nd servo tab push pull rod on Walter engine STC's. At least that's the way I read it.”

http://www.avcanada.ca/forums2/viewtopic.php?t=166927

Halestorm wrote:....There's at least 4 different engine conversions for the DHC-3 including the 1000hp PZL radial.....

I'd never heard of this. Thanks for posting that info.
I googled it up.

https://airtechcanada.com/engine-conversion/

Seems like a worthy upgrade as an alternative to a turbine.
I've heard (but don't know for sure) that the 1000hp PZL radial (as fitted on the AN2 biplane)
is a license-built copy of the Wright 1820.
This webpage doesn't come right out & say that,
but it does say it's "a 1000 hp, 9 cylinder reminiscent of the R1820 Wright “Cyclone”.

hotrod180 wrote:
https://airtechcanada.com/engine-conversion/

Seems like a worthy upgrade as an alternative to a turbine.
I've heard (but don't know for sure) that the 1000hp PZL radial (as fitted on the AN2 biplane)
is a license-built copy of the Wright 1820.
This webpage doesn't come right out & say that,
but it does say it's "a 1000 hp, 9 cylinder reminiscent of the R1820 Wright “Cyclone”.

I've been inside a few of them.... very poor copy of a Wright! I hope I never have to be inside another....but I'll take a Wright any day!!!
John

This is factual data: https://data.ntsb.gov/carol-repgen/api/ ... 105855/pdf

MTV

All---

One of the best attributes about this forum is the freedom to speculate on any topic and actually know the person behind the keyboard. Our forum here thanks to Zane is one of the unique forums on the internet where were of like minds can share opinions and observations.

I do not post much.

Grydrer is what he is, Bait click. Met him twice. He has been my passenger both times.

Sometimes he's good most times not so much. His past speaks for itself. He's about the drama.

MTV on the other hand speaks with authority and history which I respect and admire.

Lets put this this accident to bed until we have all the facts.

MW

185Midwest wrote:All---



“MTV on the other hand speaks with authority and history which I respect and admire.”



MW

Yep, very true.

185Midwest wrote:All---

One of the best attributes about this forum is the freedom to speculate on any topic and actually know the person behind the keyboard. Our forum here thanks to Zane is one of the unique forums on the internet where were of like minds can share opinions and observations.

I do not post much.

Grydrer is what he is, Bait click. Met him twice. He has been my passenger both times.

Sometimes he's good most times not so much. His past speaks for itself. He's about the drama.

MTV on the other hand speaks with authority and history which I respect and admire.

Lets put this this accident to bed until we have all the facts.

MW

Nah

He came into a civil conversation and crapped on someone who gave a very valid and thought out opinion, based on HISTORICAL accounts, he didn’t assail the facts, he went after the messenger

MTV and gryder both speak with the same authority and have the same access to the same historical facts, the YouTube guys video was about historic crashes of the airframe, MTV posted zero info, zero historic facts about the otter, he just went after the man who did

Let’s be clear, the NTSB only speculates as to what they think the outcome was, and as it stands they don’t have much to work on at this point, nor does anyone else

Interesting that inspection of the tail was just preformed this month

“ September 1, 2022. Included at that time were recurring inspections required by Airworthiness Directives (AD) 83-04-05 (control column lower assembly) and 2011-18-11 (elevator control tabs)”

http://www.kathrynsreport.com/2022/09/d ... e.html?m=0

Though lots that can’t be seen outside of full removal and inspection


I get that MTV gives some content to this site, and that’s really cool and makes this site better, but does that give him carte blanche?

Let it go…..