Can it be done? I've heard yes and others are unsure. Looks like I will be buying my first T/W a Stinson 108 here shortly so I am just wondering because I want to shoot coyotes with it and just enjoy the breeze in the summer.

I'm sure it will fly fine, probably not "legal" though.

ya I figured it would fly fine but just wasn't sure. I'll be flying it off my own strip. I'm really wanting to learn more backcountry flying but I can't afford an instructor to teach me everything so I wasn't sure if there was someone willing to help mentor me. I know I'll make mistakes but I'd like to minimize that risk as much as possible.

The little 701 was not so good on a June day with both doors off and two up for photos of the centennial parade. Barely would climb and backing off to normal cruise rpm I was barely holding altitude. The cabin of the 701 was wider at the rear for shoulder room than in front and the wind drag was like dragging a chute. I hadn't thought that through.

So what is the cabin's part of the fuselage shape of the Stinson? If the sides are straight or the cabin tapers narrower front to rear then it works best but if the cabin widens front to rear like the 701 it will make a huge difference on how much wind it catches. That was my experience.

I have been flying Stinson's for over 30 years. And yes you can fly them with the doors off.
There is nothing wrong with it. It flies just fine. Have fun with a great plane.

Ken in Alaska

Some of the best backcountry instructors in the world are over in McCall! Just don't try to do what those guys did in a Stinson this summer that's plastered all over the net.

desertflyer wrote:Can it be done? I've heard yes and others are unsure. Looks like I will be buying my first T/W a Stinson 108 here shortly so I am just wondering because I want to shoot coyotes with it and just enjoy the breeze in the summer.

I believe it's part Faa AC108 where skydivers /photo ops say it's ok. Suggest 1 door with air deflector attached to hinge points. Why not hard mount 12 gauge shotguns on struts aimed forward > I flew a 182 with 2ea 12 gauge(extra capacity ) automatic set to converge at 50-60 yards . Aiming was a grease pencil mark on windshield . Eastern Oregon ? Pendelton ?

The 108 is listed on advisory circular 105-2c as a plane that may be operated with one cabin door removed. That reference was enough to satisfy the fsdo the few times I've needed waivers for parachuting (different plane though).

Two incidents I'm aware of for you to consider:
*One fellow's passenger aimed too far forward and shot the prop, in Wyoming about 30 years ago. Forced landing, no damage except to prop, ego, and wallet.
*Couple of fellows died when they did a "moose stall" while chasing coyotes in Nebraska, some 20-30 years ago.
As they say, be careful out there!

Cary

The old AC that had the aircraft listing (105-2C) has been superseded by 105-2D, which does not include the list of aircraft now. I'm sure though, as someone stated above, when you contact your FSDO and the plane was previously on the list, I wouldn't think they'd give you too much beef.

STC Number SA224SO
Barham, Robert V
Address
1984 Capri Drive
Decatur GA, 30030
Removal of right door for parachute jumping and areal photography
Issued 01/801/1960
Responsible Office ACE-115A Atlanta Aircraft Certification Office
TC A-767 – Univair Aircraft Corp. 108 Series

There is at leaste one other one for this as well.

182 STOL driver wrote:

desertflyer wrote:Can it be done? I've heard yes and others are unsure. Looks like I will be buying my first T/W a Stinson 108 here shortly so I am just wondering because I want to shoot coyotes with it and just enjoy the breeze in the summer.

I believe it's part Faa AC108 where skydivers /photo ops say it's ok. Suggest 1 door with air deflector attached to hinge points. Why not hard mount 12 gauge shotguns on struts aimed forward > I flew a 182 with 2ea 12 gauge(extra capacity ) automatic set to converge at 50-60 yards . Aiming was a grease pencil mark on windshield . Eastern Oregon ? Pendelton ?

Thanks everybody for the info! I am located in Ontario, OR KONOas of now. It won't be long though before I keep the plane at home out of town.

Here is how Don Sheldon used to do it in the old days
It's not as easy as it looks especially in a Stinson

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Off subject a little bit but how many states is it 'legal' to put a cap in a 'yotes ass from an aircraft? Not asking about government liquidators....asking about the private individual. Always thought it would be fun if I could do it without getting put on the backside of metal bars!!!

You are right on.....lots of states don't allow it....not worth losing your plane over or a big fine. Not really a paying deal. Had a friend ( ) with a cub spend winter at it. Got 60 yotes after skinning and drying etc. Took to a fur sale and broke even considering fuel, shells and skinning charges. Not a $$$ maker but lots of fun.... ahhh... according to him. Risk reward was not worth the effort,... according to him

How do you sight in that grease mark?

soyAnarchisto wrote:How do you sight in that grease mark?

Easy sight picture-shoot forward facing guns (done several thousand hours in Army Gunships -I.E." Stinger 93"
in Vietnam .Works for me YMMV . By the way the UH-1C's in our unit had doors removed so we always had a way to get out when things went really bad. 2.75 inch rockets are(were ) unguided except by grease pencil aiming device. We had some flip down sights that were TFU (fill in your own words) -when the s*i# hit the fan you didn't have time to bring down the fricking sight and hope for the best -get it done!

I’ve got a decent handle on a shotgun’s capabilities on coyotes from the air. Seems like the strut-mounted set-up it would require pointing the aircraft at the ground while lining up that grease mark within the effective range of a shotgun..

I’d stick to ground-crew that day.

I have never seen a Stinson, so this may be completely irrelevant, but in my experience shooting coyotes from aerial platforms with a removed door, the only way to achieve safe and effective gun control is by rigging yourself into the aircraft so you’re positioned right in the doorway. A removed door is not as conducive to efficient shooting as a folding/flip-up window in a fixed-wing aircraft.

I wear a rigger’s belt with two gunner’s straps (snap-shackles through the D-ring in front, NOT in back and locking carabiners at tie-in points in the aircraft). That’s the only way I’ve found I can lean forward with my upper torso to drive the gun hard and maintain muzzle control within the zone of fire. This may be a moot point in a Stinson though?

WWhunter: how many states is it 'legal' to put a cap in a 'yotes ass from an aircraft?

The Airborne Hunting Act makes recreational hunting from an aircraft illegal. The only allowance is “…protect or aid in the administration or protection of land, water, wildlife, livestock, domesticated animals, human life, or crops…” Every western state has a federal aerial depredation program. Many states also have county or regional predator control districts contracting private depredation work.

Each state’s aerial depredation program is administered by the agency responsible with managing coyotes; department of agriculture or department of wildlife. They issue the permit which is held by the landowner/lessee, or more commonly an agent working on behalf of the landowner/lessee who is responsible for the depredation work.

For non-federal personnel, some states require the pilot and gunner to be licensed, they can fly any legal aircraft. Other states just require the pilot’s name and aircraft N-number.

DonC wrote:You are right on.....lots of states don't allow it....not worth losing your plane over or a big fine. Not really a paying deal. Had a friend ( ) with a cub spend winter at it. Got 60 yotes after skinning and drying etc. Took to a fur sale and broke even considering fuel, shells and skinning charges. Not a $$$ maker but lots of fun.... ahhh... according to him. Risk reward was not worth the effort,... according to him

I can't imagine trying to shoot yotes out of a Stenson
If u are shooting and flying it is a different and way more difficult situation. Get some life insurance for your family. If u have a gunner it is a different problem and just as much of a problem. Sitting on the left side and trying to control the shooter on the right side to keep him out of the shooting range (prop and strut) is out of your control. This is something u should consider There a lot more ways to enjoy your Stenson with a lot less risk............have fun flying

Plus are u going to buy and install skis so u can stop and pick up your bounty ? Will be about $3000 for skis and installition per FAA BS................Is it worth it

Good idea and fun but wrong airplane

There was a rancher in Texas that got in trouble for hunting coyotes out of his helicopter. He had a Schweitzer 300c rigged up with a gun port in the bubble. The gun, a .22 with a drum 180 round magazine, was on a swivel and the butt was attached to a football helmet. The gun was rigged to fire by a button on the cyclic. He used a laser for a sight. This was his poor mans look to aim system like a AH64 has. The game warden wanted to seize the chopper and the gun. FAA was not to happy as well. The helicopter still has the hole for the gun, it has a ball vent in it.