Another KUIU flop is their sleeping bags. When I saw videos about it, and when I got it I was excited. But just like their boots their sleeping bags are not sized correctly. I bought the one they said was for tall people, up to 6'5" which is just about what I am. But nope, I don't think it will fit anyone in the six foot category. Shipping it back on Monday and sticking with my Wiggys.

Backcountryrokslide.org

[emoji1]

Barnstormer wrote:Another KUIU flop is their sleeping bags. When I saw videos about it, and when I got it I was excited. But just like their boots their sleeping bags are not sized correctly. I bought the one they said was for tall people, up to 6'5" which is just about what I am. But nope, I don't think it will fit anyone in the six foot category. Shipping it back on Monday and sticking with my Wiggys.

Nothing wrong with a Wiggys, I love mine, but no one has ever used the term light weight and Wiggys in the same sentence. Take a peek at Feathered Friends. http://featheredfriends.com/ They will custom make a bag for you, if you need it. I have heard great things about them, and I know they make light bags, but I don’t own one.

Rob wrote:..At the end of the day, if the circumstances allow, it takes 3 men and a boy to come close to a good mule. This is Huckleberry, our smallest, most fine boned molly, packing a whole (quartered) smallish bull. And she can do it from places no airplane is going to reach

Rob, that's one fine looking mule!
When I was a kid, my favorite aunt & uncle (where I spent a couple summers)
had a small herd of burros that they used for packing into the Olympics.
They were a playful bunch and great fun, esp for a kid, and packed all the gear without (too much) grumbling.
Later on, they graduated to riding stock-- mules, not horses.
My aunt really got into it, she used to compete in 24 hour 100 mile endurance rides on her mule Hugo--
including the Tevis Cup (aka Western States Trail Ride) among others.
She & Hugo also participated in the coast-to-coast Great American Horse Race in 1976
They finished, well back, but the race was actually won by another mule.
https://www.atlasobscura.com/articles/t ... Fauntleroy

So thanks for stirring the old memories!

Great mule picture.

Reminded me of the time I lived in Paris. My landlord was an older fellow and, although I paid my rent in cash, he sent me a receipt each month with lots of stamps on it, stating he was an honest man. And each year, I was invited for a drink in his very nice apartment where his daughter just happened to be present. On one visit he related the secret of his fortune. The first shipment of aid given to the French in WWI was a group of mules. These weren't the well mannered French mules but ornery American ones. Well my landlord learned to work with them and at the end of the war, he bought them for next to nothing because no one else could handle them. He started a freight line with the mules and that was the start of his fortune... Never did ask him about airplanes... (not an April Fools story)

Blue skies and Happy Easter,

Tom

I do prefer the Nosler partitions for heavy game. My 270WSM likes them in 160Gr. I keep my BTs for coyotes in my 243, but at high velocity it's pretty hard on the pelts...

Prosaria wrote:

Barnstormer wrote:After a ten year hiatus I'm getting back into hunting. Since the SQ-2 will be my Jeep and I'll be doing some backpack hunts I've decided to change some things I carry, remove some, and add others. A lot of stuff will be dual purpose so I'll need a way to easily identify the stuff I carry in the plane that will be moved to my backpack for hunting. And as part of this process I'll be looking to loose weight everywhere I can, including off my person (that will be the hardest). Thought it might be helpful to others if I chronicled what I'm doing.

I'm starting by changing from an inReach SE to an inReach Explorer+. The primary reason for this is to have Game Management Unit maps so while flying and scouting, and backpacking and hunting, I won't stray into an area I can't be in.

Holy shit, the new docks have a usb charging cable? Game changer! I was annoyed that they only offered the old docks with a cigarette adaptor.

Going down this rabbit hole can cost as much per ounce as trying to shed weight from a plane, as I’m sure you are aware.

I feel like I have finally refined my lightweight (Sheep) hunting gear. I can do a 14 day hunt with less than 50lbs on my back, not including water or rifle. Some of my favorites for consideration:

•Kuiu Clothing (I don’t recommend anything that is not an article of clothing however)
•Stone Glacier pack
•”Decomposing” my freeze dried meals by losing the aluminized pouch and O2 absorber and just sticking them in quart sized ziplock.
•Only bringing food that has >100 calories per ounce
•Vapur water bottles
•A kindle, rather than paperbacks, for those weather days in the tent.

I’m currently carrying a custom sub 8lb Savage .338, but I’m contemplating building a new rifle based on a Kimber Montana. It will be a lighter, cheaper version of the Mountain Ascent.

Sorry, I know you didn’t ask for advice...

[/Ramble Off]

This might be a pain, but would you mind sharing a detailed gear list? I ask because I'd like to learn how to pack lighter. We don't have a lot of room in our Rans and I'd like to take my son out for a couple of nights. Backpack sheep hunters know how to travel light. I can easily fill a 206 for a 2 person weekend, never learned light. My mom packed a chest of drawers once for a 4 day trip to Lake Powell, no bullshit.

gbflyer wrote:
This might be a pain, but would you mind sharing a detailed gear list? I ask because I'd like to learn how to pack lighter. We don't have a lot of room in our Rans and I'd like to take my son out for a couple of nights. Backpack sheep hunters know how to travel light. I can easily fill a 206 for a 2 person weekend, never learned light. My mom packed a chest of drawers once for a 4 day trip to Lake Powell, no bullshit.

Here’s a simplified list of lightweight gear. Consider looking at backpacking specific sites for a more detailed discussion. It’s super-easy to live very comfortably for a week out of a forty pound backpack…thirty if you want to invest in seriously ultralight gear.

Sleeping:
Feathered Friends down bag.
Merino wool bag liner…to keep my sleeping bag clean.
Exped sleeping pad.
Down sweater for pillow.
Tent or tarp or nothing, depending on season. Refer to the knowledge base article on shelters.
A Thermarest chair turns my sleeping pad into a very comfortable camp chair, for very little weight.

Clothes:
Appropriate for the season, always merino wool or synthetic…never cotton, anything, ever. You should be able to wear all your clothes at the same time. If you have something that doesn’t layer with everything else you have, leave it behind.

The only things I cary a change of are undershirts (one) to change out of at the end of the day while my sweaty one dries, and socks…maybe two extra pairs in wet conditions, one in dry.

Yesterdays clothes dry out overnight and get worn again today. Any piece of clothing that doesn’t work as a layer with the other clothes is left behind. Unless it’s winter, all of my clothes, less what I’m wearing, take up about as much space as a football.

Cooking:
Cooking means boiling water, nothing else.

I use an alcohol stove that weighs less than one ounce, and a one-quart titanium cup. Everything gets cooked in that, and eaten out of that. If two people, I add a two-quart aluminum tea kettle (and another titanium cup and spoon), as it saves enough fuel to warrant the weight and bulk. For flatware I have one plastic spoon and my utility knife. I do not cary dish soap, a frying pan, a coffee pot, plates, cups, bowls, etc..

Food is anything that cooks when added to boiling water, or doesn’t need cooking. Coffee is Starbucks Via. Spices are salt, pepper, and chilly powder.

Water filtration and storage is done with a Sawyer squeeze filter. Contrary to popular belief, backcountry water isn’t toxic. I happily drink straight from streams in any roadless area not inhabited by horse packing camps.

151 proof rum is half as bulky as 80 proof rum!

Toiletries:
Toothbrush, travel size toothpaste, travel pack of kleenex.

First aid:
I assemble my own kit, and it fits in a quart ziplock bag. If I’m hiking extensively I’ll add extra foot care items. If I’m going to be remote for more than two weeks I’ll add extra medications…antibiotics and pain killers mostly.

That’s it…you’re packed. Camera, binoculars, fishing equipment, pipe and tobacco, firearm, etc… it’s up to you to decide how valuable it is. Remember that you’re done packing when you cannot think of anything else to leave behind, not anything else to bring.

I should note that I pack like this regardless of how much weight capacity I have, because I find it to be the easiest and most comfortable way to live in the bush. (Any extra weight capacity is generally used for beer.) Everything you bring has to be unloaded and loaded multiple times, and it never packs down as small as it did at home. When the weather is bad, a change of clothes just means extra wet clothes to lug around.

I do a lot of multi-day whitewater kayaking, where weight and bulk are huge issues. When I see people in rafts with tables and chairs and extensive cookware and complicated meals, I just feel bad for them. What a stupid way to spend your time in the wild! They spend all their time packing, unpacking, and doing domestic chores so they can live like they do at home. It sort of begs the question; why go rafting at all?

Somehow people got the idea that a steak or lasagnia or ice cream will taste extra-good in the bush, but it doesn’t. It tastes exactly like it tastes at home, only it’s a HUGE pain in the ass to drag it and the necessary kitchen with you.

Pitching and striking camp should take less than twenty minutes each way. If it doesn’t, you’ve got too much crap. It’s the simplest thing in the world to go from waking up to traveling in forty minutes, and if I need to get somewhere I’ll go from wake-up to engine start in twenty minutes, coffee and breakfast included.

The guy who built my SQ-2 went to great lengths to save weight everywhere he could, for instance there are no controls in the back seat. But it wasn't just the big things, he also looked at saving a few grams everywhere he could because grams add up to ounces and ounces add up to pounds. When I bought the plane I made myself a promise that the mods I would do to it would not add weight, and I would try and save weight anywhere I could. The easiest weight saver I did was when I switched from the Odyssey battery to the EarthX battery which is about six pounds lighter. Changing from the Garmin 695 to an iPad Mini saved more weight. This allowed me to add some weight back when I changed the front suspension from AOSS to TK1. And when I mounted my inReach and added some Lemo plugs for the headsets.

So I said earlier as I go thru the gear I carry for survival and for backpacking/camping I'll be looking to both consolidate and save weight at the same time. I've been a little slow on updating this thread because I've been busy with the purchase of another plane which I'll share as soon as it's done.

Anyway back to lightweight flying products. My SQ-2's stick boot is made from naugahyde which of course comes from the now endangered animal the Nauga. The boot has developed a tear in it so I need a new one. Now I've always thought that a Nauga is one of the ugliest creatures and I've never liked their hyde. So I decided to go with kangaroo leather (lighter and stronger then other leathers). And as long as I was doing that I decided to change colors from black to brown to go with the color scheme of the plane. I got the leather in yesterday now it just needs to go to the seamstress to get cut and sewn up. For those that might be interested I purchased it here:
http://maverickleathercompany.com/

Talk about drifting your own thread...

Hammer wrote:

gbflyer wrote:
This might be a pain, but would you mind sharing a detailed gear list? I ask because I'd like to learn how to pack lighter. We don't have a lot of room in our Rans and I'd like to take my son out for a couple of nights. Backpack sheep hunters know how to travel light. I can easily fill a 206 for a 2 person weekend, never learned light. My mom packed a chest of drawers once for a 4 day trip to Lake Powell, no bullshit.

Here’s a simplified list of lightweight gear. Consider looking at backpacking specific sites for a more detailed discussion. It’s super-easy to live very comfortably for a week out of a forty pound backpack…thirty if you want to invest in seriously ultralight gear.

Sleeping:
Feathered Friends down bag.
Merino wool bag liner…to keep my sleeping bag clean.
Exped sleeping pad.
Down sweater for pillow.
Tent or tarp or nothing, depending on season. Refer to the knowledge base article on shelters.
A Thermarest chair turns my sleeping pad into a very comfortable camp chair, for very little weight.

Clothes:
Appropriate for the season, always merino wool or synthetic…never cotton, anything, ever. You should be able to wear all your clothes at the same time. If you have something that doesn’t layer with everything else you have, leave it behind.

The only things I cary a change of are undershirts (one) to change out of at the end of the day while my sweaty one dries, and socks…maybe two extra pairs in wet conditions, one in dry.

Yesterdays clothes dry out overnight and get worn again today. Any piece of clothing that doesn’t work as a layer with the other clothes is left behind. Unless it’s winter, all of my clothes, less what I’m wearing, take up about as much space as a football.

Cooking:
Cooking means boiling water, nothing else.

I use an alcohol stove that weighs less than one ounce, and a one-quart titanium cup. Everything gets cooked in that, and eaten out of that. If two people, I add a two-quart aluminum tea kettle (and another titanium cup and spoon), as it saves enough fuel to warrant the weight and bulk. For flatware I have one plastic spoon and my utility knife. I do not cary dish soap, a frying pan, a coffee pot, plates, cups, bowls, etc..

Food is anything that cooks when added to boiling water, or doesn’t need cooking. Coffee is Starbucks Via. Spices are salt, pepper, and chilly powder.

Water filtration and storage is done with a Sawyer squeeze filter. Contrary to popular belief, backcountry water isn’t toxic. I happily drink straight from streams in any roadless area not inhabited by horse packing camps.

151 proof rum is half as bulky as 80 proof rum!

Toiletries:
Toothbrush, travel size toothpaste, travel pack of kleenex.

First aid:
I assemble my own kit, and it fits in a quart ziplock bag. If I’m hiking extensively I’ll add extra foot care items. If I’m going to be remote for more than two weeks I’ll add extra medications…antibiotics and pain killers mostly.

That’s it…you’re packed. Camera, binoculars, fishing equipment, pipe and tobacco, firearm, etc… it’s up to you to decide how valuable it is. Remember that you’re done packing when you cannot think of anything else to leave behind, not anything else to bring.

I should note that I pack like this regardless of how much weight capacity I have, because I find it to be the easiest and most comfortable way to live in the bush. (Any extra weight capacity is generally used for beer.) Everything you bring has to be unloaded and loaded multiple times, and it never packs down as small as it did at home. When the weather is bad, a change of clothes just means extra wet clothes to lug around.

I do a lot of multi-day whitewater kayaking, where weight and bulk are huge issues. When I see people in rafts with tables and chairs and extensive cookware and complicated meals, I just feel bad for them. What a stupid way to spend your time in the wild! They spend all their time packing, unpacking, and doing domestic chores so they can live like they do at home. It sort of begs the question; why go rafting at all?

Somehow people got the idea that a steak or lasagnia or ice cream will taste extra-good in the bush, but it doesn’t. It tastes exactly like it tastes at home, only it’s a HUGE pain in the ass to drag it and the necessary kitchen with you.

Pitching and striking camp should take less than twenty minutes each way. If it doesn’t, you’ve got too much crap. It’s the simplest thing in the world to go from waking up to traveling in forty minutes, and if I need to get somewhere I’ll go from wake-up to engine start in twenty minutes, coffee and breakfast included.

Thank you. I'm with ya so far except for the toiletries part...can't say one pack of Kleenex would suffice and I need my socks.

Seriously though, thank you. That's a big help.

I don't have a fraction of the backcountry flying experience as most here, but I have been hunting Alaska since I was a kid and have been hunting sheep for 20+ years. Although I appreciate lightweight gear, I'm willing to carry some ounces and pounds that others choose to cut. Some comforts are worth it, frankly. Below is my working list that I go through prior to each trip, though some of these things get cut depending on the mission or length of trip. I made this list quite a few years ago and have altered some of the gear, but this at least gives an idea of things to consider.

Clothing - packed
• 1 pair merino socks
• 1 pair merino boxers
• 1 long-sleeve shirt
• rain pants
• rain jacket
• bandana
• hat
• gloves
• puffy jacket
• puffy pants
• sandals for river crossings
• lightweight dry bag for clothes

Clothing – worn
• boots
• gaiters
• merino socks
• softshell pants
• merino shirt (x2 – lightweight short and long sleeve)
• merino boxers

Hunting gear
• 10-15 rounds ammunition
• firearm
• binoculars
• spotting scope
• cutco hunting knife
• havalon knife
• 1 set TAG game bags
• License/tags

Safety/utility gear
• InReach
• Topo maps
• camera + extra battery
• ¼ roll electrical tape
• small amount of duct tape
• 50’ of 2mm cord
• headlamp
• 2 lighters
• prescription painkillers
• ibuprofen
• glucosamine
• skin stapler
• bandages (Ace, band-aids, guaze)
• 2 contractor bags
• Go-lite SL-3 for siwash (or lightweight tarp shelter?)

• roll toilet paper
• extra pins for pack
• pack cover?
• Leukotape
• Inhaler (wife) + allegra D
• Hot hands (wife)
• Trekking pole
• Toothbrush/paste

Sleeping/camp gear
• Marmot Grid 2p
• sleeping bag in compression sack
• sleeping pad
• Ti-goat bivy
• 6 extra stakes for guy-lines

Food
• Jetboil with 2 canisters
• water filter or steripen
• cup
• spork
• camelback 3L
• nalgene
• 1 mountain house dinner per day
• 1 mountain house breakfast per day
• 2 bars (snickers, Kind, etc.) per day
• 1 hunter stick per day
• Bag of various nuts, chocolate raisins
• 1 coffee packet per day/tea bags for Sara
• 2 desserts
• Bottle olive oil

To be left at airstrip
• 10 lbs salt
• 3 extra meals
• 1 extra set of clothes
• Extra sleeping bag?? (primary bag is down)
• Wine
• Spices for ribs
• Extra shoes
-Satellite phone?
-lightweight bear fence (deployed around airplane)

ATV specific hunts
• NF 4 man tent
• Waders to scout river crosings
• Containers for blueberries
• Small firearm for ptarmigan
• French press and ground coffee
• Small tarp
• Tow rope/extra winch
• 4 stroke oil
• gasoline
• heavy (orange) raingear
• flagging tape
• ground anchor
• xtratuffs
• wine/beer/whiskey
• heavy dry bags
• regulations book
• extra game bags for incidental animals
• Reading material
• Tools for tightening chain


And since we're talking sheep hunting, here is the first one that I flew in for - also my wife's first sheep after years of trying. I've taken a number of sheep previously, but it sure was satisfying to fly us in.

Great thread Phil... I've been travelling for a while and have been missing out on one of my favorite topics. I love guns, mules, gear and hunting.

I can vouch for Feathered Friends and Stone Glacier products.

Nobody has mentioned good quality walking sticks... I couldn't be in the mountains without them. And a nice Swarovski spotting scope, of course, because I'm better at spotting than walking!

Brian M wrote:I don't have a fraction of the backcountry flying experience as most here, but I have been hunting Alaska since I was a kid and have been hunting sheep for 20+ years. Although I appreciate lightweight gear, I'm willing to carry some ounces and pounds that others choose to cut. Some comforts are worth it, frankly. Below is my working list that I go through prior to each trip, though some of these things get cut depending on the mission or length of trip. I made this list quite a few years ago and have altered some of the gear, but this at least gives an idea of things to consider.

And since we're talking sheep hunting, here is the first one that I flew in for - also my wife's first sheep after years of trying. I've taken a number of sheep previously, but it sure was satisfying to fly us in.

Great post and congrats to you and your wife, great Ram. I recognize the handle from the outdoor forum.

Phil, I have been a leupy diehard since forever. But last year I put a opted for a Z5 on a .300wby I built up from an inherited action. In it's prior form this rifle struggled with keeping a scope zero'd. Hence the election to use the Z5 for it's excellent erector set up. Love the glass, but not sure it fits the bill as a long range scope with the limited turret functionality.
That works out fine for me, as I'm not really a long ranger. Ironically the two bulls it has killed in it's present form were both at ranges I normally would pass on or work down. But in the end, with all the right pieces in play, using this set up at 'extended' ranges is almost cheating I would have normally balked at the extra weight, but on this rig, it's probably a good thing.
I did a 6.5 on a model 7 for a lightweight mountain rifle, but I never could warm up to it. Right now my favorite sheep rig is a .280 Rem. Built right it will push 150gr. LRAB's at 7mm Rem speeds on less powder with less heft to carry, and a smoother shooter to boot. If a little extra weight is ok and a little more 'reach out and touch someone' is warranted I have a .270 Wby mag I affectionately call my laser Surprisingly mild kicker for the charge.

This IS a great thread.

Take care, Rob

Rob, Why didn't you warm to the Creedmoor? Very hot cartridge these days, especially in light rifles. I'm not sure it would be my go-to for moose but my nephew shot a nice elk last year at over 300 with his and the elk was dead before it heard the shot.

I'm building a 6.5 PRC off a Kimber Montana at the moment. I'm not a good enough marksman to bring the best out of a really light rifle so it will be a 'fairly light' not an ultralight. I'm thinking Swaro Z5 for glass.

Phil, I hope you love that Barrett. Ronnie Barrett is a good friend of a close friend and I enjoy watching their success.

Ah, guns. This thread got my blood flowing and I spent the evening cleaning and organizing the reloading room. I hope nobody lights a match near that garbage bag;-) I found out my favorite bullet for my 9.3x62 has been discontinued so now I get to play around building another load for that gun.

The amphibs are going on my plane in 2 weeks. I like to think I'll be doing some awesome hunting this season but unless I find a high-time float guy that likes to hunt I will likely be pretty cautious for the first year. Hunting in remote areas is a challenge in itself, being your own pilot/outfitter adds a whole new dimension.

Hi AB,

I wrote a big long dissertation on why exactly the 6.5CM didn't light my fire, and it pretty much drifted off into space
Long and the short of it, I have two other 70 year old 25 cal.s that accomplish pretty much the same (and better) and I have been shouldering those rifles for as long as my kids have been alive.
Take care, Rob

Thanks guys for your comments. I'm looking forward to learning and sharing.

If I'm spraying something at a bear you can believe it contains lead. Originally I carried a S&W 460, but that is a rather large weapon. So I down graded to a Ruger Alaskan in 454 Casull. When I'm flyfishing I carry it in a chest holster. But till now when I'm flying I alway carried it in the baggage compartment and invariably didn't bother to get it when I landed and headed off on a short hike. Three times I didn't bother with it I found my self near a grizzly. So I decided it was time to get a belt holster so I'd just wear it all the time I'm flying. Originally looked for a synthetic holster to save weight but didn't like anything I saw. Started looking for leather holsters and came across Earl Southard of Trailmaster Holsters. Had him build this custom holster for me and the cost was only $120! He should charge twice that at least if you ask me. I'm super stoked, thank you Top, and here it is:
http://www.trailmasterholsters.com

Barnstormer wrote:Thanks guys for your comments. I'm looking forward to learning and sharing.

If I'm spraying something at a bear you can believe it contains lead. Originally I carried a S&W 460, but that is a rather large weapon. So I down graded to a Ruger Alaskan in 454 Casull. When I'm flyfishing I carry it in a chest holster. But till now when I'm flying I alway carried it in the baggage compartment and invariably didn't bother to get it when I landed and headed off on a short hike. Three times I didn't bother with it I found my self near a grizzly. So I decided it was time to get a belt holster so I'd just wear it all the time I'm flying. Originally looked for a synthetic holster to save weight but didn't like anything I saw. Started looking for leather holsters and came across Earl Southard of Trailmaster Holsters. Had him build this custom holster for me and the cost was only $120! He should charge twice that at least if you ask me. I'm super stoked, thank you Top, and here it is:
http://www.trailmasterholsters.com

Good looking holster. I’ll be interested to hear how it works for you. Not sure why a belt holster will be more comfortable than a chest holster while flying...

In my experience firearms get left behind because they are uncomfortable to wear, and practically never used. I dislike carrying a firearm that heavy on anything other than a dedicated weapon belt...not something I’m going to wear unless I’m getting paid. Trouser belts just don’t distribute the load effectively.

I’ve also found that larger weapons often ride more comfortably on the belt than smaller ones because there’s more body contact, and even though they’re heavier, they put less load on the belt.

I often carry a Glock 20, but the only gun I always carry is a titanium .357 snub nose revolver...not because I think it’s a superior weapon, but because it weighs 11 ounces. It’s not as capable as some guns, but it’s infinately more capable than any gun that got left back at the airplane...

Hammer wrote:...I always carry is a titanium .357 snub nose revolver...not because I think it’s a superior weapon, but because it weighs 11 ounces. It’s not as capable as some guns, but it’s infinately more capable than any gun that got left back at the airplane...

Can't argue with that logic, or weight.

A friend of mine has something like that-
his is a S&W model 342.
I just love Chief Specials- I own 4 of them.
Two model 36's, a pre-model 37, and a model 60.
But even those little snubbies can be a PITA to carry.
So my EDC is a Ruger LCP 380-- yeah, a mouse gun.
People have laughed about that,
but most of them shut up when I ask them about what gun they're (usually not) carrying.
Better the mouse gun you always have on you,
than the (insert favorite gun) you leave in the car or worse yet in the gun safe.
"Darn fool brought a knife to a gun fight".