It continues to be an amazingly warm December, and a perfect excuse to play hooky from work. After a couple of days of rain, the clouds broke and I jetted over to Sherman field for a quick visit with my friend Dick.

Nice work.

Could not help but notice the old hard brake lines. You should put on the pliable steel braided lines and you can then also get rid of the fitting halfway down the strut and make it one solid line.

Also noticed your lines are coming in over the strut. Have always put mine under the strut. Is there a correct way? Have always thought that routing them under was correct.



Keep the posts coming. Nice work!

AKT

Vick wrote:I like these minimalist interiors - what's the approval basis for them? I heard of a guy who had stripped his interior and was later told his plane was unairworthy by the big brother types. Field approval to cover the removal of the factory interior and installation of just the insulation?

This is a good question. My thinking, which could get me in a lot of trouble, goes back to the TCDS. There is generally an equipment list spelled out as necessary for flight. For instance, some airplanes MAY not be flown without a spinner. It's part of the engine cooling system. But following that logic would one be allowed to fly without a seat for the pilot? I don't think so. There must be something deeper here knowing the fed's propensity for eliminating gray areas. One can certainly remove all the other seats. Wiser minds than mine should weigh in here.

EB

As far as seats go, every adult passenger has to be seated in an approved seat, with approved belts. There are exceptions for certain kinds of operations, like skydivers, but....

Seats and belts are in the equipment list. They may be installed or removed as necessary, and that's typically spelled out in the equipment list.

Headliners, seat coverings, door panels are interior parts, and I've never heard of the FAA having any interest in them, EXCEPT that to be legal, ALL materials must have a burn certificate.

MTV

Fun to see you wheel landing now in the 180.

Jeredp wrote:
My plan was to talk with selkirk about buying the material in bulk from them. I've heard good things about them and would like to support a local northwest business. I've had the same experiance with Spruce. I wonder if selkirk would sell a guy the kit and an extra couple feet of bulk material to remake the ones that don't fit???

I also used closed cell foam for my ceiling and baggage area.
I ordered this from Aircraft Spruce.... it was crap. It would never hold up and infact seen some damage just in the install. I gave up after just a few panels and will try to return it.
http://www.aircraft-spruce.com/catalog/appages/supersoundproofsheet.php

I ended up buying bulk from Selkirk at half the price of Aircraft Spruce. Their foam is much better quality.
I made templates with poster paper, it worked well and I ended up with a good fit.
Was a two day job for me with making the templates.

I have mtv. I had an engine failure 2 yrs ago. Landed in a plowed field that was to soft (prior to bushwheels) and she ended up on her back. Did nothing wrong. Guy even said great job. Then gave me 3 warnings. 1.unsafe operation of aircraft in the air..wtf?? 2.flying in airworthy aircraft 3. Failure to quit flying it once I knew it was unairworthy. The reason... No interior panels or headliner!!! I argued it..which really worked. Ha. Then got my notice for a 407 reride to make sure I'm competent. Love those guys. Also categorized it as an accident not incident because the spar was bent. After I showed him it wasn't and was pleading for an incident, he took a pair of pliers, ripped my skin open more and claimed he could see 2 bent ribs and that means accident. I asked where it said that. He said, can't remember but ill check! Lol. Sorry for the rant. Just a sore spot.

I am one to remove everything that does't add to the mission. But, some interior finishing help cover control rigging, insulate and protect aluminum fuel lines, etc.

Noise in an SEL can be dampened considerably with a good finished interior.

8GCBC wrote:I am one to remove everything that does't add to the mission. But, some interior finishing help cover control rigging, insulate and protect aluminum fuel lines, etc.

Noise in an SEL can be dampened considerably with a good finished interior.

Zulu's are lighter.

55wagon wrote:I have mtv. I had an engine failure 2 yrs ago. Landed in a plowed field that was to soft (prior to bushwheels) and she ended up on her back. Did nothing wrong. Guy even said great job. Then gave me 3 warnings. 1.unsafe operation of aircraft in the air..wtf?? 2.flying in airworthy aircraft 3. Failure to quit flying it once I knew it was unairworthy. The reason... No interior panels or headliner!!! I argued it..which really worked. Ha. Then got my notice for a 407 reride to make sure I'm competent. Love those guys. Also categorized it as an accident not incident because the spar was bent. After I showed him it wasn't and was pleading for an incident, he took a pair of pliers, ripped my skin open more and claimed he could see 2 bent ribs and that means accident. I asked where it said that. He said, can't remember but ill check! Lol. Sorry for the rant. Just a sore spot.

Wing ribs are structural. Bend a rib and it's an accident by definition. NTSB 830 is the rule, not the FARs.

But, as I have noted numerous times on this and other forums, the FAA is not one big happy organization, all components of which will always interpret every regulation or rule the same way as the guys down the road.

Therefore, you modify airplanes at your peril. I would argue that removing interior panels, as long as they are not structure or "guards" of some kind, is a minor alteration. Now, that doesn't mean that an owner can remove all the interior panels from an airplane and go fly it....ANY alteration, even a MINOR alteration must be properly logged in the aircraft logs by a properly licensed mechanic. AND, a new weight and balance certificate has to be prepared, either based on math or on re-weighing the airplane. Either is legal, but if you've changed the weight of the airplane, it needs a new W/B certificate.

Again, you modify airplanes at your own peril. GENERALLY, if you have an STC or a field approval, that will keep the FAA away in a different district. That said, I have had a field approval rescinded by the FAA (long story). That was punitive in nature, directed at the mechanic that signed off the field approval...... And, I've had a field approved mod yellow tagged by an inspector in a different district. That one got sorted out by the Region, in my favor.

But, if I pulled a lot of stuff out of my airplane, I'd want an A & P to sign it off, and prepare a new w/b certificate before I'd fly it.

MTV

aktahoe1 wrote:Could not help but notice the old hard brake lines.

AKT

Actually those are brand new SS lines which were installed when the new Clevelands were installed along with the tires. They look old as they are wrapped in plastic loom for protection. I will replace the rest of the brake lines when I really get into the resto.

RE: up or under... Not sure what is correct. On my C170, they were below. On the Skywagon, they were above. We replaced the new lines the same way they came off. Seems to me they are much more protected above from shrubs etc than below.

Greg-

Where do you get those hd axles bigrenna?

Axles were ordered from Spruce. Not sure if I could have done better on $$$. Was in a hurry to get them installed and flying. Had a bulk order coming so I just added them.

Greg-

bigrenna wrote:

aktahoe1 wrote:Could not help but notice the old hard brake lines.

AKT

Actually those are brand new SS lines which were installed when the new Clevelands were installed along with the tires. They look old as they are wrapped in plastic loom for protection. I will replace the rest of the brake lines when I really get into the resto.

RE: up or under... Not sure what is correct. On my C170, they were below. On the Skywagon, they were above. We replaced the new lines the same way they came off. Seems to me they are much more protected above from shrubs etc than below.

Greg-

Greg, he is actually talking about the hard metal brake line that comes out of the fuselage and goes half way down the gear leg. You can't tell from his picture, but Kevin's steel braided brake line goes from the caliper all the way up to the fitting on the side of the fuselage. It's a pretty nice set up, I'd like to do the same thing on my plane.

blackrock wrote:

8GCBC wrote:I am one to remove everything that does't add to the mission. But, some interior finishing help cover control rigging, insulate and protect aluminum fuel lines, etc.

Noise in an SEL can be dampened considerably with a good finished interior.

Zulu's are lighter.

No?

What you flying where can't afford some common sense comfort?

robw56 wrote:
Greg, he is actually talking about the hard metal brake line that comes out of the fuselage and goes half way down the gear leg. You can't tell from his picture, but Kevin's steel braided brake line goes from the caliper all the way up to the fitting on the side of the fuselage. It's a pretty nice set up, I'd like to do the same thing on my plane.

Thanks jackass... something else I have to order.

Thats a good idea. I will do that when I really get into in in Jan.

I can come up with more ideas if you need help spending your money

Ideas I love... Spending all this cash, getting to the puke point. (well is almost dry)

bigrenna wrote:Ideas I love... Spending all this cash, getting to the puke point. (well is almost dry)

An old joke, what is the easiest way to make a million dollars in the Aviation business?

START WITH TWO!!!

8GCBC wrote:

blackrock wrote:

8GCBC wrote:I am one to remove everything that does't add to the mission. But, some interior finishing help cover control rigging, insulate and protect aluminum fuel lines, etc.

Noise in an SEL can be dampened considerably with a good finished interior.

Zulu's are lighter.

No?

What you flying where can't afford some common sense comfort?

Not so much giving up comfort as weight. When building the Bearhawk, I looked closely at a lot of options and your right certainly some of the comfort items are just not worth giving up. I went for temper foam seats which are heavy but comfortable, added an autopilot, again a comfort feature and sacrificed some weight there also. When it came to the interior coverings however, in my opinion, it would have added to much weight for the benefit, especially since the noise issue is remedied with good headsets that I would have anyway. So any added weight for the interior, by that reasoning, did not add any other value (comfort). And yes, it is one noisy bird inside at full power with the 540 swinging an 84" prop at 2700 rpm.

I don't believe I applied this rule of thumb to the interior per say, but when making equipment choices, I came to the understanding that a 1-pound weight savings was worth $100 to me. Now that said, that is just me, others mileage may vary.