I think the Mossberg Scout rifle, and other brands as well, are great rifles, super handy and reliable. A .308 is way more thump than any handgun cartridge.

I carry a S&W Governor in a chest holster (let the revolver purists go nuts right now) and I love the gun. I can push a 280 grain hardcast at close to 1000fpm which will penetrate a long ways into any furry critter, and throw some #4 410 shotshells in it for grouse, rabbits, squirrels, whatever I would need to eat in a real survival situation. I target practice with every type of round it will feed and am very comfortable shooting it realistic distances.

In my opinion a good pump shotgun stowed with the survival gear is my #1 choice for a long gun, a big bore lever gun is #2.

If want something cheap to beat up you might want to try this. I didn't want to waste cash on a pistol grip only because I wasn't sure how useful it would be and I have three other shotguns, but I did always want a pistol grip. If you're a bigger guy with a good grip and able to control, with a bunch of practice its fine. These are $365 CAN including shipping. Come's with the pistol grip plug and two other stocks, one fixed one telescoping seen in the pic. They're short and light, this one has taken a beating, never cleaned, never even been put in a bag just gets abused and loves it, I always take good care of my guns but it's great to just have a beater like this.

Rogue wrote:If want something cheap to beat up you might want to try this. I didn't want to waste cash on a pistol grip only because I wasn't sure how useful it would be and I have three other shotguns, but I did always want a pistol grip. If you're a bigger guy with a good grip and able to control, with a bunch of practice its fine. These are $365 CAN including shipping. Come's with the pistol grip plug and two other stocks, one fixed one telescoping seen in the pic. They're short and light, this one has taken a beating, never cleaned, never even been put in a bag just gets abused and loves it, I always take good care of my guns but it's great to just have a beater like this.

OK, I'll bite... What is it? (Brand / Model?)

JP256 wrote:

Rogue wrote:If want something cheap to beat up you might want to try this. I didn't want to waste cash on a pistol grip only because I wasn't sure how useful it would be and I have three other shotguns, but I did always want a pistol grip. If you're a bigger guy with a good grip and able to control, with a bunch of practice its fine. These are $365 CAN including shipping. Come's with the pistol grip plug and two other stocks, one fixed one telescoping seen in the pic. They're short and light, this one has taken a beating, never cleaned, never even been put in a bag just gets abused and loves it, I always take good care of my guns but it's great to just have a beater like this.

OK, I'll bite... What is it? (Brand / Model?)

Yeah it's a strange one, they come up branded a few different things with the same model number but I think they're all cheap turkish Uzkons re-branded before import. This one is a Balikli AS41. Everything looks pretty well the same as a Rem 870 pulled down, I think they just straight up copied it. I added a few links below, solid gun far as I can tell, never even oiled it and hasn't missed a beat.

https://www.nasgunsandammo.com/product/balikli-as42-12-gauge-short-barrel-pump-action-shotgun-overfold-stock/

https://www.lockharttactical.com/shop/product/8564853-uzkon-short-barrel-pump-action-shotgun

Henry AR7 This is what I have in my survival pack. Also carry a 380 handgun on my person. If I was going into Bear country I'd pack my Mossberg 500

A Ruger 10/22 Take-down is what I have as a survival gun. I wanted something I could use to feed myself (and whoever is with me) if we're stuck somewhere for longer than the food holds out. I've never been good enough with a pistol to trust it to feed me, but am pretty decent with the rifle.

Obviously, a .22 is no good for bear in a "defense" situation, but it's good enough for coyotes, and great for rabbits, etc. And it's light enough (including tons of ammo) to make the cut when it comes to "what actually goes on this trip". (Or at least it will be, when the Bearhawk Patrol is finished and flying.)

For all you folks worried about "food" in a survival situation, consider the experience of Ralph Flores and Helen Klaben: http://people.com/archive/the-miracle-s ... l-3-no-11/

Do a little search on the internet and you'll find lots about their experience. They survived just fine without ANY food to speak of for seven weeks, in REALLY cold temperatures.

So, with a SPOT or an InReach device, do you REALLY need a gun to gather food? I think not.

For years, I flew with my service handgun, which initially was a S&W .357, followed by a S&W .40 Auto, followed by a Sig Sauer .40 cal auto, followed by a Glock .40 auto. I left the Service issued AR-15 at home, and most days, I left the Service issued Remington 870 at home as well. Lugging all that hardware around in an airplane gets complicated, and busy.

We issued Remington 870 shotguns coated with armaloy coatings, with long tube magazines and 18 inch barrels to all our field crews. I was in charge of the bear safety and firearms qualifications training for northern Alaska. I trained folks who'd never SEEN a gun of any kind to shoot an 870 proficiently in a week easily, and usually a lot less. All our 870s had a coating for corrosion prevention, and plastic stocks for durability. A side saddle carrier on the side of the receiver to hold bean bag rounds, slugs or????

Those guns would live in the bottom of a canoe all summer, and still function. Cleaned??? That's funny, right there. But, when needed they'd function.

Semi Auto shotguns will malfunction at some point. They're way too picky for me in this context. Pump actions work, every time, when you need them. Remington makes good ones. You don't need stainless....just get it coated....lots of outfits out there that'll do that.

But, when I was flying, I had to wear the .40 anyway. A friend killed a grizzly with his .357....of course, she was chewing on his ankle at the time. That's called presence of mind: Grizzly chewing on right ankle.....draw .357, stick muzzle in bear's ear, pull trigger. But, a shotgun or guide gun would have been useless there.

The best gun is the one you'll have handy when the shit hits the fan.

Full disclosure: I own a Guide Gun in .45-70. Not a bear gun, but a fun piece of work, nonetheless.

MTV

For big threats, the Marlin in 45-70 is hard to beat.

A good allrounder is a 12 gage pump. I like the Remington 870 Marine Magnum - nickel coated, synthetic stock, designed and purpose built for shit weather.

Any .22 that reliably feeds any ammo is nice to have just for plinking, sustenance would be a bonus should it come to that.

Well after all the time tagging bears in Alaska, I find any pistol that has a smooth barrel with no sights to be best. So when the bear uses it as a proctoscope it doesn't hurt as much. We carried Winchester model 70's African Mags in .338. Well I'm not all that interested in carrying that anymore. I have two; I like an Remington 870 Wingmaster, military model (ugly pakerized, rifle sights, long magazine). The other is one I basically made. Started as a Armalite AR7, I added a different folding stock to make it lighter and better handling. Since it is an early model from the 60' s it loads reliably. The later ones (made by a dizzying array of folks, who sold the molds to each other) they used the same molds, which got increasing old and not so precise in their dimensions. The magwells tend to float a bit and the magazine is not pushed aft far enough. So sometimes a couple of strips of tape on the forward part of the magwell, or epoxy helps push them aft into the correct position.

Normally I just toss this rifle in the plane with a bag. I like to take shot shells. They taught us in survival if we want food, we are far more likely to survive off tweety birds, squirrels and mice rather than anything big that would take a bullet and not vanish in a red cloud (make a soup). A monkey can hit a squirrel with a .22 shotshell from 10 feet. Food is better than cool. If you want to scare something, noise works better than shooting them, but there are those times...

Nice little rig.
I forgot all about the A7.
I had a Henry A7 and soldit years ago before the plane... might revist that!

Personally, I'm a huge fan of the Kel-Tec Sub-2000 Gen2, chambered in 9mm. This is a generic picture, because I am not home right now. Im on the road.

I love that It accepts my Glock 19 magazines and that it is a light weight folder. Sending those 9mm rounds home to 100yds with ease. This can fit in a small backpack and can match the magazines of a few common handguns and ammo sizes. simple and sweet. Certainly worth a look into IMHO.

lownslow79 wrote:Personally, I'm a huge fan of the Kel-Tec Sub-2000 Gen2, chambered in 9mm. This is a generic picture, because I am not home right now. Im on the road.

I love that It accepts my Glock 19 magazines and that it is a light weight folder. Sending those 9mm rounds home to 100yds with ease. This can fit in a small backpack and can match the magazines of a few common handguns and ammo sizes. simple and sweet. Certainly worth a look into IMHO.

Not seeing the image.

Cary

lownslow79 wrote:Personally, I'm a huge fan of the Kel-Tec Sub-2000 Gen2, chambered in 9mm. This is a generic picture, because I am not home right now. Im on the road.

I love that It accepts my Glock 19 magazines and that it is a light weight folder. Sending those 9mm rounds home to 100yds with ease. This can fit in a small backpack and can match the magazines of a few common handguns and ammo sizes. simple and sweet. Certainly worth a look into IMHO.

Show me a five-shot, 50 meter group under three inches and I'd start to think about it... Kel-Tec makes sexy weapons, but they're not known for accuracy, or reliability, or longevity.

Also not sure what niche a handgun cartridge fills in the backcountry. Too small for things trying to eat you, and to big for things you want to eat. Great for killing other people, but that's more of a frontcountry priority.

Looks fun...just not sure what use it'd be for folks in the woods.

Looks like it'd be good for two-legged varmints, longer effective range than a pistol and higher velocity too.
Plinking.
Maybe small game with ball ammo, esp with head shots--
I've read lotsa magazine articles about hunting small game using hard-cast bullets,
or larger caliber rifles using reduced loads.

RockHopper wrote:Mike, While the takedown is nice, it's not 3200 bucks nice.-well unless you decide to fly an extra trip to pay for it? I have the standard 45-70 Marlin SS Guide gun and that is plenty short enough to fit in the back of the wagon. Also, you don't have to put together all the time. 400 grain flat nose hard cast will just about stop any beast in its tracks.

Same here (Marlin SBL 45-70). The Marlin's ghost peep sight, SS corrosion resistance and laminated stock make it just about the perfect brown bear area safety rifle. That, or a stainless 12 gauge. 12 ga is nice because you can switch from bear stopper to bird getter by reaching into your pocket for different shells. Put a sling on either to keep it handy and on you when needed.

Re: bear spray, I am a believer, but has anyone else tried the trainer canister in high winds or heavy rain? I'll take a firearm in those conditions.

I also firmly believe that, no matter what is carried, stress-induced training is essential to ensure adequate performance for when it really counts.

A couple of weeks ago a backcountry pilot with friend flew his Stinson into a remote Chilcotin strip for some hardcore mountain biking. Blasting around a curve in the trail a short time later, the lead bike came across a sow grizzly with cub. He skidded to a stop as the sow charged. His partner rounded the bend as the grizzly was charging and he kept going, stopping beside his partner, leaping off his bike and holding it up hollering the whole time. The bear charged several times, stopping just short of the two guys waving their bikes and hollering, then eventually it ambled away after its cub.

I asked him if he had pepper spray and he did, but in the stress of the situation didn't have time to pull it, and in hindsight thought that breaking eye contact to fumble with his canister might have been enough for the bear to complete the charge. Ditto a gun, nice thought but can you have it ready to shoot on target in a second or two. BTW, this guy was a wilderness guide working a local lodge guiding groups in bear country for the past 5 years.

Karmutzen wrote:.....His partner rounded the bend as the grizzly was charging and he kept going, stopping beside his partner, leaping off his bike and holding it up hollering the whole time. ....

Lotta balls on that partner! Hope the first guy appreciates what he did..
Kinda reminds me of the punchline from that joke about wearing sneakers in grizzly country:
"Don't have to out-run the bear, just have to out-run you."

hotrod180 wrote:

Karmutzen wrote:.....His partner rounded the bend as the grizzly was charging and he kept going, stopping beside his partner, leaping off his bike and holding it up hollering the whole time. ....

Lotta balls on that partner! Hope the first guy appreciates what he did..
Kinda reminds me of the punchline from that joke about wearing sneakers in grizzly country:
"Don't have to out-run the bear, just have to out-run you."

That's why the 2 things you need to survive in bear country are a buddy and a .22 pistol. Encounter bear, shoot buddy in knee, run like hell.

Cary

After scaring off a large cinnamon black back bear a while back with nothing more than my double-ott, magnum stink eye, I now carry a Marlin 45/70 guide model. It's short enough to not be cumbersome in the Skywagon but long enough to still point while I am distracted by the pee running down my leg.

Also a fan of the Marlin 1895. Something about 540gr of lead that gives me the warm and fuzzies...