As discussed in other threads I wanted to avoid thread drift.

I am curious what this year looks like for those who are already insured. How much did your premiums go up?

I've been in the aircraft market for a while. Each year reevaluating market prices and insurance quotes to see if I was comfortable with the entry. I can confidently say over the last three years the insurance quotes have continued to go up even as my hours increase. It feels kind of like chasing the needle. Even buying something relatively inexpensive outright and self-insuring to build time, wouldn't have yielded me any lower premiums financing a more expensive aircraft down the road.

This last two weeks has been very interesting as I tried to position myself to just pull the trigger and hope the premiums drop in the long run. Falcon wouldn't even quote me citing they weren't interested in doing Alaska Tailwheel "at this time".

Avemco faded me in with a very reasonable premium for my time and 5 days later more than doubled it.

BWI Just got back to me and said USSIC is only quoting hull values of over 150k. Really?

Insurance is a sore subject and we all have understood the instability over the years. However, something seems very different. It's not just sticker shock, it's major under writers getting out of GA less than 150k hull.

Where does this go from here?

Delete ,,,, just being negative

These guys are pretty good

https://airpowerinsurance.com/

NineThreeKilo wrote:These guys are pretty good

https://airpowerinsurance.com/

Thanks I'll check it out. Unfortunately it seems like there's only a handful of underwriters in the entire industry and everyone else just brokers through the same ones.

Assured Partners Aerospace through AOPA declined every year and then in November 2020 with everything else equal it went up $100 on my 55 170B with hull coverage.

https://www.assuredpartners.com/blog/de ... ge-in-2021

I probably need to up my hull since the values have jumped in the past year.

My 1969 Cessna 182 went up roughly 20% in January. Haul value was 65k and it went from 580ish to 730/year. I'm wrapping up a pponk conversion on it now and requested the haul value be raised to 125k. It took the yearly cost up to 1170 but the max they would insure the haul for was 124,062, which I thought was interesting given the current 182 market. Obviously cost varies a lot on ratings and hours but I like to see real numbers so Ill share mine.

We live in an airpark and carry liability insurance for it. This year it also went up a bit but only one company was willing to quote it. Interesting times for sure

Just renewed with Avemco. Rate increased $100 from last year. But last year it actually went DOWN $50, so this years increase is minimal.

Do you already own a plane? If not, a lot of these folks aren’t going to spend a lot of time on a quote.

Find a good carrier, and stick with them.

MTV

Minimal increase with Avemco.

Just renewed cub and 180 insurance with Avemco. Zero increase. Same rate I’ve had for 15 years on the cub and since owning 180 for 5 years. I’ve shopped around before but nobody comes remotely close to Avemco (for me at least).

Have Avemco, no increase on a TCraft I own 50% of, and a 5% increase on my 180 due mostly to increasing the hull value a bit. I know it's all in what you're used to, but those lower 48 premiums seem like chump change compared to Alaska premiums.

Do any of the Canadian contingent know if Avemco offer their products above the 49th parallel ?

I used AOPA and they typically offer a policy with AVEMCO and Old Republic. I go with whatever company is cheaper every year, the details in the policy are not noticeable enough for me to care. This year is was ~$1560 for a policy covering the Cessna 140 and 182 which is a little more than normal. The value of the 182 has gone up ridiculously so I need to increase the hull value on it.

I get a quote from Avemco every year. All three years I’ve flown my Bearhawk their quote have been at least a thousand dollars more than Global through a broker. 2019 quote was $7500 (new airplane with zero time and they wouldn’t cover till the airplane had 15hours). 2020 quote was $4500 (hull value dropped to $100k from $125k in attempt to make insurance affordable). 2021 quote was $5500.

I paid $4600 in 2019, $3400 in 2020 and didn’t bother getting a quote from the broker in 2021. They said to expect at least a 20% increase.

whee wrote:I get a quote from Avemco every year. All three years I’ve flown my Bearhawk their quote have been at least a thousand dollars more than Global through a broker. 2019 quote was $7500 (new airplane with zero time and they wouldn’t cover till the airplane had 15hours). 2020 quote was $4500 (hull value dropped to $100k from $125k in attempt to make insurance affordable). 2021 quote was $5500.

I paid $4600 in 2019, $3400 in 2020 and didn’t bother getting a quote from the broker in 2021. They said to expect at least a 20% increase.

AVEMCO is an underwriter of their own policies, the only company that does so in aviation, I believe. They are pretty risk averse, and I suspect they aren't big fans of experimental aircraft.

When I was in Alaska, I insured my 170 with them, and I'd insured a Super Cub and a 180 with them previously. When I put the 170 on floats, rates went up a LOT. I called them, and they pointed out that floatplanes are more often totaled than wheel planes, etc.

Then I started instructing in my own plane. I went with straight liability. I've forgotten the quote I got from another Broker, but it was insane. AVEMCO said they wouldn't insure me at all for instruction in my plane. I got liability from another brokerage.

Till I moved to lower 48, then I re-upped with AVEMCO.

They are pretty risk averse. If one pilot has an accident, everyone in the "pool" pays for it. AVEMCO tries to keep the "pool" shallow.....

MTV

Another data point: I've been using Falcon for 15 years. I upped my insured hull value 30% this year due to a new fancy panel and the market being what it is. My premium only went up around $300 from last year. I also just crossed 1,000 hrs tailwheel, much of which is in 180s which I'm sure helps.

I bought a 1966 182J in 2017 right after attending the Army FW course. At the time I had about 4500 hours total time, Less than 100 hours airplane time. First year premium ran about $1200, the next year just under $700 and the last two mid $700 and that was with me increasing the hull value to $75k. If I had to pay tail dragger premiums I wouldn’t have an airplane.


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Wow. Really good info. No I don't already own a plane. I'm a 100hr pilot looking to buy a TD in AK. Seems those who have hours and already own aren't feeling the squeeze. Getting into one however, seems very hard at this point. I think being an alcoholic and wallowing about it might be cheaper.

dwill wrote:Wow. Really good info. No I don't already own a plane. I'm a 100hr pilot looking to buy a TD in AK. Seems those who have hours and already own aren't feeling the squeeze. Getting into one however, seems very hard at this point. I think being an alcoholic and wallowing about it might be cheaper.

Yes, aviation is by definition not inexpensive. Particularly in Alaska. I spent almost thirty years in Alaska, and owned airplanes almost that entire time. There was a lot of that time that I carried Liability only, because having to pay hull coverage would have put me out of airplane ownership. But, that was because of what I wanted to do with the airplane.

Nevertheless, while a crack cocaine habit might be less expensive, I doubt that you'd ever regret owning an airplane in Alaska. Alaska is truly the Great Land, but in all seriousness, the only way you can see more than about 1/10th of one percent of it is from an airplane.

If you want to be an airplane owner, suck it up, find a good basic plane, buy it, and find insurance coverage. As you build experience, your premiums should decrease. Depending on where you are and what you want to do, there's nothing wrong with a tricycle gear airplane either, and insurance will be quite a bit lower in that case.

But, if you don't have the passion, don't go there, because you'll always be troubled over the cost. It's not inexpensive, and insurance is just one cost you'll have to bear. Do some basic math. You might have to, as a young lady I know put it, "Eat ramen for two years" to make it work, but.....

In my opinion, was it worth it? Absolutely, 100 %, and I'd do it again in a heartbeat. And,. my budgets were tight for many years to make it work.

MTV

Insurance… Taildragger…. Nightmare

My buddy and I, both low timers… We pay $6900 a year for hull ($190K) and liability.

Nope, not fun

I never had flown anything but a tail wheel until I bought a 172 as a 100hr private pilot. Put 400 hrs of relatively inexpensive time on it, gaining experience. Now I get to fly Beavers,185’s, etc…never would have happened if I had stretched my finances and experience thin by buying that Maule, 180 or other HP taildragger that I HAD to have.

Get over the wallowing about insurance rates in Alaska and buy a 150 or 2 place tail wheel that you can afford to buy, maintain, and insure. Go fly now and upgrade when conditions/market improve.