Airdave100 wrote:Agree with comments by others....insurance is a Global Market...we think aircraft but the reality is our activity is part of a very very large pool of risks....we enjoyed several years of lower costs...now it trues up...

Here’s my issue...I am approaching age 69...I changed carriers this year on my Brokers advice to Global because they more tolerant of Aged Aviators...seems most carriers look less than favorably on older pilots ...especially those who fly with Basic Med....and generally decline to quote those over 70.....

I just logged 50 years of safe flying, 2000 hours Private with Instrument....and no claims....

Are there other Aged Aviators heading the same....strategy...? Flying without at least liability coverage is unattractive......

I’m 73, and on Basic Med. Duh! Talk to AVEMCO. As I pointed out earlier in this thread, my rate hasn’t significantly changed in several years.

One thing I was told a long time ago: Don’t change insurers if you’re getting “mature”

MTV

AXA is the underwriter. I use a broker in Calgary that specializes in commercial carriers. I’m fortunate that they represent me to the underwriters. They only take us private guys by referral.

mtv wrote:

Airdave100 wrote:Agree with comments by others....insurance is a Global Market...we think aircraft but the reality is our activity is part of a very very large pool of risks....we enjoyed several years of lower costs...now it trues up...

Here’s my issue...I am approaching age 69...I changed carriers this year on my Brokers advice to Global because they more tolerant of Aged Aviators...seems most carriers look less than favorably on older pilots ...especially those who fly with Basic Med....and generally decline to quote those over 70.....

I just logged 50 years of safe flying, 2000 hours Private with Instrument....and no claims....

Are there other Aged Aviators heading the same....strategy...? Flying without at least liability coverage is unattractive......

I’m 73, and on Basic Med. Duh! Talk to AVEMCO. As I pointed out earlier in this thread, my rate hasn’t significantly changed in several years.

One thing I was told a long time ago: Don’t change insurers if you’re getting “mature”

MTV

Jebus Mike, you are 73?

We just quit buying it. I built the damn thing so I can fix it.

G44 wrote:

mtv wrote:

Airdave100 wrote:Agree with comments by others....insurance is a Global Market...we think aircraft but the reality is our activity is part of a very very large pool of risks....we enjoyed several years of lower costs...now it trues up...

Here’s my issue...I am approaching age 69...I changed carriers this year on my Brokers advice to Global because they more tolerant of Aged Aviators...seems most carriers look less than favorably on older pilots ...especially those who fly with Basic Med....and generally decline to quote those over 70.....

I just logged 50 years of safe flying, 2000 hours Private with Instrument....and no claims....

Are there other Aged Aviators heading the same....strategy...? Flying without at least liability coverage is unattractive......

I’m 73, and on Basic Med. Duh! Talk to AVEMCO. As I pointed out earlier in this thread, my rate hasn’t significantly changed in several years.

One thing I was told a long time ago: Don’t change insurers if you’re getting “mature”

MTV

Jebus Mike, you are 73?

Hard to believe it my own self.....

MTV

Mike, agree on staying with same insurance. After owning/flying 40+ yrs of different TWs we bought Husky nearly 2 yrs ago and went with a new company that didn't require duel in Husky. A very good national broker (we've been with them nearly 35 yrs) informed us insurance company would probably drop us as I'm 69 with a TW. Our 210s have been with USAIG for over 35 yrs; so, added Husky to that policy and we're PROBABLY good for the long haul. Very few things in life are guaranteed....
Jack

Headed out Saturday with camper/me driving and wife flying Husky for 6-8 weeks in ID and NW. Retirement is great.

gbflyer wrote:We just quit buying it. I built the damn thing so I can fix it.

Liability is also a concern, at least for me.
Hurt or god forbid kill someone & you'll likely be sued into bankruptcy.
Not where I want to go at age 64.

FWIW I insure my C180 through BWI, current underwriter is AIG.
Full coverage, $90K hull.
As of last fall, I paid $1,493 a year.
I have over 3000 hours, all but 300 or so in taildraggers,
& about 600 in the 180.

Got a quote today from an AOPA affiliate

The email started out "sorry it's so high, they (assuming underwriters) REALLY don't like Alaska, AND they really don't like Maules apparently" lol. I appreciated the honestly.

It's funny how an airplane gains a reputation. Whether deserved it not.

hotrod180 wrote:

gbflyer wrote:We just quit buying it. I built the damn thing so I can fix it.

Liability is also a concern, at least for me.
Hurt or god forbid kill someone & you'll likely be sued into bankruptcy.
Not where I want to go at age 64.

FWIW I insure my C180 through BWI, current underwriter is AIG.
Full coverage, $90K hull.
As of last fall, I paid $1,493 a year.
I have over 3000 hours, all but 300 or so in taildraggers,
& about 600 in the 180.

Yep. Good idea

I'm not running without liability coverage, hull could be talked out of possible.

dwill wrote:Got a quote today from an AOPA affiliate

The email started out "sorry it's so high, they (assuming underwriters) REALLY don't like Alaska, AND they really don't like Maules apparently" lol. I appreciated the honestly.

It's funny how an airplane gains a reputation. Whether deserved it not.

The Maules “reputation”, in this case the actuarial, is quite accurate and deserved. But it is really a Maule pilot thing....nothing wrong with Maules. Lots of them rolled up in balls.....

MTV

I was close to buying a Maule MX7 before I bought my 185. The insurance quote was about the same at 90k hull on the Maule as it was for 180k hull on the 185. And you know the 185 is more expensive to fix boo-boo’s on. What does that tell you

So where is the actuarial math showing the sky is raining old geezers?

I don't see many NTSB reports or Kathryn articles indicating age was a factor.

I only know of one personally and while he was old, the truth is he was a lousy pilot for several years leading up to his demise. And since he went down in a grove of trees the liability pay out was near zero

mtv wrote:

dwill wrote:Got a quote today from an AOPA affiliate

The email started out "sorry it's so high, they (assuming underwriters) REALLY don't like Alaska, AND they really don't like Maules apparently" lol. I appreciated the honestly.

It's funny how an airplane gains a reputation. Whether deserved it not.

The Maules “reputation”, in this case the actuarial, is quite accurate and deserved. But it is really a Maule pilot thing....nothing wrong with Maules. Lots of them rolled up in balls.....

MTV

Would love to see actual data on this. Insure can't find the data that says it's any more dangerous or accident prone that a comparable aircraft. In fact the only data I could find was per flight hour deaths were less in the Maule then that of several other like types

Keeps getting funnier. All lined up to buy. Have two loan approvals. I'm a very qualified buyer good credit etc. The deal breaker? Deductible. The loans I've been approved for require no more than 1-2 percent of the loan amount. Well, most quotes are 4-6 percent deductible given the current inursance market. My deductible quotes are about 500 to 1,000 over the banks max of 2500. They'll lend me significant amounts, but break the deal over 1k worth if deductible that's non negotiable. It's a underwriter hard stop.

If I put more money down and finance less? It actually gets worse, because now the max deductible limit drops down even lower, but the insurance deductible stays the same until it gets down to 59 percent less hull value than I'm asking. They seem to be quite out if sync. High booming insurance premiums, crazy low interest rates. Meh

Put a term deposit equal to the deductible with the bank?

Prepay the deductible to the insurer with a refundable deposit?

dwill wrote:Keeps getting funnier. All lined up to buy. Have two loan approvals. I'm a very qualified buyer good credit etc. The deal breaker? Deductible. The loans I've been approved for require no more than 1-2 percent of the loan amount. Well, most quotes are 4-6 percent deductible given the current inursance market. My deductible quotes are about 500 to 1,000 over the banks max of 2500. They'll lend me significant amounts, but break the deal over 1k worth if deductible that's non negotiable. It's a underwriter hard stop.

If I put more money down and finance less? It actually gets worse, because now the max deductible limit drops down even lower, but the insurance deductible stays the same until it gets down to 59 percent less hull value than I'm asking. They seem to be quite out if sync. High booming insurance premiums, crazy low interest rates. Meh

Yep, he’s an internet troll....

Maybe you should try to find the airplane you can afford......just saying.

MTV

mtv wrote:

dwill wrote:Keeps getting funnier. All lined up to buy. Have two loan approvals. I'm a very qualified buyer good credit etc. The deal breaker? Deductible. The loans I've been approved for require no more than 1-2 percent of the loan amount. Well, most quotes are 4-6 percent deductible given the current inursance market. My deductible quotes are about 500 to 1,000 over the banks max of 2500. They'll lend me significant amounts, but break the deal over 1k worth if deductible that's non negotiable. It's a underwriter hard stop.

If I put more money down and finance less? It actually gets worse, because now the max deductible limit drops down even lower, but the insurance deductible stays the same until it gets down to 59 percent less hull value than I'm asking. They seem to be quite out if sync. High booming insurance premiums, crazy low interest rates. Meh

Yep, he’s an internet troll....

Maybe you should try to find the airplane you can afford......just saying.

MTV

I'm not sure I understand how this classifies me as an internet troll? Just sharing a story of challenges in the market. Maybe there are fellow lower time pilots who aspire to fly an aircraft they want to fly. This is a discussion board and I'm interested to see if anyone is having similar experiences, maybe advice. Just because I do not want to burn cash savings doesn't mean I can't afford the aircraft. Everyone's situation is different. Not everyone got handed the family aircraft or buys a 185 cash. Times change and 10 years ago I'm sure it wasn't an issue for someone to fly a tailwheel in Alaska like it is today. Everyone has to start somewhere. Maybe you're right, maybe I'll end up picking up a Cessna 140 for cash and fly the skin off it.

Either way, first you come and say Maules earned a reputation and deserve it but dont provide any statistics or evidence. You're not hurting my feelings, I don't work for Maule. Then label me a troll and tell me I should buy something I can afford condescendingly.

Classy

Pinecone wrote:Put a term deposit equal to the deductible with the bank?

Prepay the deductible to the insurer with a refundable deposit?

Yeah kind of what I was thinking. Who knows, local bank maybe they'll rather get the business than ditch it over 1k I'd gladly pay up front or escrow.

Good suggestion

dwill wrote:

mtv wrote:

dwill wrote:Keeps getting funnier. All lined up to buy. Have two loan approvals. I'm a very qualified buyer good credit etc. The deal breaker? Deductible. The loans I've been approved for require no more than 1-2 percent of the loan amount. Well, most quotes are 4-6 percent deductible given the current inursance market. My deductible quotes are about 500 to 1,000 over the banks max of 2500. They'll lend me significant amounts, but break the deal over 1k worth if deductible that's non negotiable. It's a underwriter hard stop.

If I put more money down and finance less? It actually gets worse, because now the max deductible limit drops down even lower, but the insurance deductible stays the same until it gets down to 59 percent less hull value than I'm asking. They seem to be quite out if sync. High booming insurance premiums, crazy low interest rates. Meh

Yep, he’s an internet troll....

Maybe you should try to find the airplane you can afford......just saying.

MTV

I'm not sure I understand how this classifies me as an internet troll? Just sharing a story of challenges in the market. Maybe there are fellow lower time pilots who aspire to fly an aircraft they want to fly. This is a discussion board and I'm interested to see if anyone is having similar experiences, maybe advice. Just because I do not want to burn cash savings doesn't mean I can't afford the aircraft. Everyone's situation is different. Not everyone got handed the family aircraft or buys a 185 cash. Times change and 10 years ago I'm sure it wasn't an issue for someone to fly a tailwheel in Alaska like it is today. Everyone has to start somewhere. Maybe you're right, maybe I'll end up picking up a Cessna 140 for cash and fly the skin off it.

Either way, first you come and say Maules earned a reputation and deserve it but dont provide any statistics or evidence. You're not hurting my feelings, I don't work for Maule. Then label me a troll and tell me I should buy something I can afford condescendingly.

Classy

Sir, you have put up post after post whining about things over which none of us have any control. Nor do you.

As to Maule statistics, why don’t YOU take the initiative and do some research on that yourself. After all, YOU’RE the one allegedly interested in purchasing a Maule. I simply stated that Maule pilots have experienced a LOT of accidents, and hence claims. You argue with me because you can’t be bothered to do your own research? Do a search of the NTSB accident records and get back to us. Perhaps then you’ll understand why Maule insurance rates are high.

Have you ever flown a Maule? I have. They are great airplanes but they can be a little busy on the ground. No problem for a competent well trained pilot, but....

I didn’t intend to be condescending when I suggested that you stop whining about everything and everyone in aviation being out to get you. Seriously, figure out what you CAN afford, find one and buy it. I doubt that many of us started out with our dream airplane.

It’s apparent from your own posts that a Maule may be out of your price range. So be it, there are all sorts of planes out there. Do some more research, or maybe re-evaluate your finances.

MTV