Hope everyone had a very nice christmas!

Our temps where im located have been dipping into the low 30's during the evening and early morning hours. I currently have the cowl wrapped with two shipping quilts that i got a home depot. I also have a 100 watt treble light stuck up in each cowl flap. The engine has no leaks down to where the lights are, do you think this is a good method for keeping the engine happy? I am not planning on doing this all winter, but maybe just plug them in a day or two before a flight?

My oil is W100 so im sure its as thick as molasses when its cold.

Thanks

On the Coast of Oregon, KONP ( 10F - 55F) I use:

http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/eppages/ezHeater.php?clickkey=261944

http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/eppages/phillipsxc.php?clickkey=289949

Also close my adjustable cowl flap and/or install cover on oil cooler. In the hangar before engine start I get about 60F on the engine throughout. My cowl cover is a $10 WalMart sleeping bag which covers the top half.

You could pull the dipstick and see how runny the oil is. I bet it gets fairly warm doing it you way.

At those temps, the lights will work fine.

Or, switch to multi viscosity oil and don't worry about pre heat. With cold soaked engine at 30 degrees I wouldn't hesitate to fire up, if the engine has multi vis oil.

Bear in mind Lycoming says you should pre heat below 10 degrees....

I use 30 for my cutoff, but I use multi vis all year.

MTV

I use a straight weight, 80 in the winter, 100 in the summer. I preheat below 40F, but I have started the engine without preheat at around 25F or so--it's harder to start, and it's better to have it preheated--on that occasion, the hangar's fuse had blown.

If it gets much colder than your temps of low 30s, and that's a regular situation, you'd be much better off installing a preheating system--that way you can start just like it's a Spring day, and it's lots easier on your engine. I like my Reiff "standard" system--which frankly is so good that I'm not sure the extra cost of their "turbo" or "turbo XP" systems are worth the extra cost. It consists of 50 watt heated bands that are installed around each cylinder and a 100 watt heating element which is glued to the bottom of the oil pan. I also have a small 25 watt heating element glued to the oil cooler. http://www.reiffpreheat.com/product.htm Even at a temp of around zero in my unheated hangar, I have Spring-like temps throughout the engine within about 4 hours of turning it on, as long as I have the padded cowl cover and prop and spinner covers on it. If I leave the covers off, it takes a whole lot longer, like 7 or 8 hours.

Considering the cost of a new engine, the cost of a proper preheater is chicken feed. For my 4 banger Lycoming, it's $435 + $98 for the oil cooler option. Figure $550 to include shipping--and that's only 2% of what my engine cost me 11 years ago.

Cary

Doesn't get cold enough on the coast for pre-heat. I run Aeroshell 15W50 in the O-320, and POH says no need to pre-heat down to 20F. My other O-360 is on straight 100, and I would preheat if less than 40F. T-shirt weather for guys that fly in the real cold.

Just installed an EZ Heat 440 on my Super Cub. Haven't had a chance to use it yet, but looks like I will this week. Lows in the teens and highs in the low 30's, so if I'm gonna fly I'll plug her in and let 'er warm up first. I'll give a PIREP as soon as I find out how well it works.

FWIW - A $20 electric heating pad (one without the auto-shutoff feature) positioned under & touching the sump works really well. Wrap the cowling in an old sleeping bag or blankets and it's good for way down below freezing...

Since you mentioned lightbulbs... we know you have power nearby. Light bulbs are OK, but the heat is really not directed very well.
Get a small orange heater pad to stick on the oil sump. You can get it from Spruc (EZ HeAT) and it will have a good warranty.... or from an automotive source and it will be cheap. In about 4 hours, my O-320 is over 90F and happy to go flying.
Covers and cowl plugs also keep the rising heat in the area... so the cylinders won't be chilly as well.
I turn mine off and on via the cell phone. (switchbox and app)

flightlogic wrote:Since you mentioned lightbulbs... we know you have power nearby. Light bulbs are OK, but the heat is really not directed very well.
Get a small orange heater pad to stick on the oil sump. You can get it from Spruc (EZ HeAT) and it will have a good warranty.... or from an automotive source and it will be cheap. In about 4 hours, my O-320 is over 90F and happy to go flying.
Covers and cowl plugs also keep the rising heat in the area... so the cylinders won't be chilly as well.
I turn mine off and on via the cell phone. (switchbox and app)

The EZHeat device is fine, but please do not just go down to your friendly NAPA Auto Parts store and buy one of those cheapo silicone heat pads and glue it to your oil pan.

The difference?? The EZ Heat pad has a thermostat. It shuts off if the pad gets too hot. Those cheapo silicone pads have been looked at by a couple engine overhaulers, who found burned oil inside the pan where those pads were attached. Also, if you don't get those pads bonded very well to the pan, any gaps MAY cause an overheat and potentially a fire, or cooked oil.

Assuming you cover the cowling with some sort of insulation, almost any SAFE source of heat, including guarded light bulbs, will produce a warm engine. If you're not going to cover the cowling to insulate it a bit, you're kind of wasting electricity.

Again, if the coldest you're likely to get is 30, and that not very often, I'd just switch to multi viscosity oil, and not worry about it.

But, the EZ Heat system is good, the Reiff Pre Heat System or the Tanis systems are all great systems if you have really cold temperatures.

The comment earlier about the "Turbo heat" model vs the base model: I worked airplanes parked outside in temps down to -40. At those kinds of temps, the "turbo" model is definitely necessary. But, if you're not going to operate in those environments, the basic models work fine. And, again, with a good insulated engine cover, and temps around zero or a little below, the EZ Heat system works just fine, as long as you give it the time to warm the whole engine mass.

MTV

Thank you for the help on this matter, we have usually one week that gets pretty cold. Ive got friends who have the built in heating systems, but they are not parked indoors. Most of my amigos that are indoors are doing the same thing im doing plugging it in the night before a flight and making sure its wrapped up like a burrito.


Thanks

Last night at KONP the air temperature low was 30F:


During the night I plugged in my EZheat. CHT 50F/Oil 100F at about 6:00PST before engine start:


Weather has been great in Oregon! Flew for about 2.5 hours enjoying the clear skies!

Installing the Tanis system...will augment with the Red Dragon if the engine doesn't warm up quick enough.
Don't pay attention to the gap in the new baffles...little massaging...they fit better now. Waiting on a snap-on stud driver. Two of the trough studs protrude 1.040". Have to screw them in to .875". Then the last cylinder will go on.
Mark M.
Platinum Ak.

m_moyle wrote: Waiting on a........

Aww the wait.... Hope your weather is nice out there. Anything froze or are you getting rain on new years eve also......

Not a lick of ice. Great icing conditions though. 33 degrees dew point at 32 degrees 93% humidity. Love it! Haven't had to plow the runway once this winter...poor unloved 140M

I am not sure why people get so cheap. I guess not really cheap, just false economics. They will spend $30 k on a new engine, but won't spend an extra $800 on a proper engine cover and preheater system. I would never consider starting my engine anywhere close to freezing. Light bulbs and old sleeping bags? Cheap yes, but is it cheap when your plane burns to the ground and you attempt to collect on insurance? Pretty scary stuff. I know I couldn't sleep at night thinking about oil/fuel possibly dripping on a 100 watt light bulb in my cowling.

Mark Y. wrote:I am not sure why people get so cheap. I guess not really cheap, just false economics. They will spend $30 k on a new engine, but won't spend an extra $800 on a proper engine cover and preheater system. I would never consider starting my engine anywhere close to freezing. Light bulbs and old sleeping bags? Cheap yes, but is it cheap when your plane burns to the ground and you attempt to collect on insurance? Pretty scary stuff. I know I couldn't sleep at night thinking about oil/fuel possibly dripping on a 100 watt light bulb in my cowling.

I don't disagree with you regarding pilots' proclivity toward saving money in some strange places, whilst spending buckets of it in others.

That said, a guarded light bulb (trouble light) placed in the TOP of the cowl isn't likely to have any fluids drip on it.

I've heated engines with light bulbs, with catalytic heaters, with Herman Nelson heaters, Tanis systems, Reiff systems, EZ Heat, and automotive interior heaters. They all work. For portability, the car interior heaters are easy, and reliable. They do make a lot of heat. And, again, they need to go in the upper part of the cowling.....

Not rocket science. A well insulated engine will warm nicely with not much heat at the temps you're talking about. Remember, though....the critical part is to get the heat to the center of the mass of the engine.....that takes some soaking time, won't happen in just an hour or so, unless you apply a LOT of heat....like with a Herman. And, I've seen paint cooked off cowlings with those things by dummies.

MTV

MTV

+++++++1

Don't skimp on engine cover. Heat for way longer than you might think is enough. You can have your engine case red hot, but the oil will still be a frozen lump in the sump. Don't forget those expensive gyros sitting in your panel, cold kills them. Put a heater under the panel, and a blanket over the glareshield to keep it localized.

Of course, this is for -30, not +30, but even at +30 your engine and gyros will thank you.

Gump

Here is a short, worthwhile read for those wondering about pre-heat.

http://www.avweb.com/news/maint/182846-1.html

That is a great article. Another great item is an insulated prop/spinner cover in addition to the insulated engine cover. There has been issues with the front crankshaft bearing/seal remaining frozen even with a preheated engine under cover. I run the reiff turbo xp system and a lil buddy cockpit heater in the cabin. I will fly until temps hit -25 C/-13 F. Even at this temp engine is hot to touch in less than 5 hrs. If I am visiting airports without power I carry a 1000 watt honda suitcase generator. Reiff system is very efficient and this little generator is enough to run it. (Not the cabin heater though)

I know other systems do work (Blowpots/herman nelsons/frost fighters, light bulbs), but i would not leave them unattended.