richpiney wrote:
Our latest fixed wing project is another Cessna 182 Taildragger conversion. This one is a 1960 182C. ….... We will be using the Rod Rawson STC again......


http://rgl.faa.gov/Regulatory_and_Guida ... 3139AT.pdf

Thanks Hotrod180 for finding and posting that!

What do you guys use for stripping the paint Rich?.

It takes a selection of stripper to figure it out. Today for example, the aircraft stripper second in from the left worked great on the top of the wing. Made great progress until we flipped the wing and I started again. The aircraft had Canadian numbers at one point along the bottom of the wing, which were then painted over.

What a pain! That stripper stalled out and I switched to the Zip strip. It did better, but a ton of elbow grease!
That stripper plumb wore me out. All day on one wing and I will still have some tune up in the morning.
The stripper on the far right says it works in ten minutes. Maybe that means it will burn you after that long? I’m not sure what “work” actually means. Maybe it’s like my kids. “We’ve been working all day”
All jokes aside, I’m sure there’s something it “works great on”

Stripping an aircraft is a lot of work no matter what. It’s not for the nauseous or faint of heart. It’s a huge project especially if you are doing it in your spare time. My own Cessna 182C, currently a work in progress was literally a nightmare to get the paint off. It was a stripping experience no doubt.



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This one works on some of the Huey’s. You have to spray it and wrap it in plastic and leave overnight.

Thanks for the info Rich. The aluminium under your paint looks scuffed. On spots where the paint is coming off on my 206 it almost looks polished underneath. Hoping that means it will strip easier.
So for the detour. Back to your thread. It looks awesome. Lots of work for sure, and I'll enjoy watching the progress!

David

There’s another Eldorado paint stripper for epoxy paint from PPG, PR-3500:

http://www.ppgaerospace.com/Products/Co ... stems.aspx

Some work on one paint surface, but not on another. One thing for sure, a heated shop is a big help!

The aircraft is completely stripped now. I found a new meaning for "A wing and a prayer". Hoping and praying that the paint won't take forever to remove from the lifting surfaces... Lots of surface area there for sure.



Since we have a jig/holding fixture, it's very nice to use it!




The nose dragger gear can be removed out of the way.



A few of the tools. 4 pneumatic drills, one for each size of rivet, and a 4th electric for specialty quick changing. Hammer, chisel, punch
In a production shop, it's better to spend the time drilling than changing out bits.



The bottom center skin is drilled away from what will now become the new gearbox area. Notice the existing bulkheads running fore and aft.

Not a sign of corrosion, this aluminum looks just like it did when it left the factory in 1960!



If you look closely, you can see the factory provided holes for the location of the gear leg fittings.



A view from above, the corresponding floor skin above is removed and replaced. The new skin will be thicker and will also extend forward an inch or so to pick up a very stout piece of angle that will be riveted to the top forward side of the forward bulkhead.



The decision was made to remove the forward belly skin, for cleanup and better access.



Some of the removals, mostly associated with the no longer existing nose wheel. Most of this stays put in the Baer conversion for the older 182's.



Lost of access now.



Forward belly skin after a rough clean-up. Also notice the original bottom skin drilled from between the two bulkheads that now become the the new gear box area. This skin will be replaced with a much thicker one with the same shape as the one in top of the picture. The one shown is for illustration purposes only. It was removed from a Selway Backcountry Buster and retained for show and tell.



Shown is a "porkchop" steel fitting that will be installed on each outbard side of the forward bulkhead of the new forward gear box area. These tie the inboard gear fitting, outboard gear gitting, bulkhead, belly skin and even a few rivets into the forward door post. It's very similar to the existing ones on the aft side of the aft bulkhead, where the lift strut fitting ties in. It is shown next to a doughnut for size reference. (Texas)



Sorry for not having part numbers and or exact part names and descriptions, but I have limited time today, but did want to update the progress as it occurs.

Does this mod remove the gear leg mounting structure for the original MLG?
My C150 "Texas Taildragger" left that in place.
Too bad, woulda been good to shed all possible excess weight.

Wow, cool project!

I haven't seen so many different strippers since years ago when my ex wife used to invite her friends over for parties!

pilot wrote:Wow, cool project!

I haven't seen so many different strippers since years ago when my ex wife used to invite her friends over for parties!

Hah! Was waiting for someone to go there.

Nevermind the ladies, that modified Pacer in your profile picture tho!

Awesome project, reminds me of some good old days.

Have you ever tried a quick change chuck on your drill motors? Much faster than plugging and unplugging a bunch of drill motors.
What we used when I was in production sheet metal.



Pretty good deal on them at the Yardstore

Will a tailwheel converted 182 A-D (with tailplane screw jack trim), achieve original early 180 values?

Or will it remain at early 182 values.

Put another way a converted Pacer is generally regarded as a Pacer and valued as such, and with some premium over the Tri-Pacer.

Personally I would value a conversion higher because of lower
chance of hidden damage in gearbox area and less use and abuse over similar aged 180’s.
Dave

Sorry for the delay, it's been hectic since Thanksgiving!

Does this mod remove the gear leg mounting structure for the original MLG?
My C150 "Texas Taildragger" left that in place.
Too bad, woulda been good to shed all possible excess weight.

The original gear leg structure stays in place per the STC.

Have you ever tried a quick change chuck on your drill motors? Much faster than plugging and unplugging a bunch of drill motors.
What we used when I was in production sheet metal.

Thanks for the info and link on the quick change chuck. Looks like a pretty neat setup for sure.

There has been some progress. L&R external Doubler as well as the internal splice doublers have been drilled up.




A view of the new bottom skin.


Work is now complete on the replacement corrugated rudder and straight tail vertical.

The shop is full again. The red and white 1960 Cessna 182 coming together is my own project. It happens before 6:00 a.m. I suppose at some point it should have it's own restoration post....

What is the approximate man hours investment and cost of the STC and related parts for a 180/182 (A/B) tailwheel conversion?

Which is the best STC for the process?

L18C-95 wrote:Will a tailwheel converted 182 A-D (with tailplane screw jack trim), achieve original early 180 values?

Or will it remain at early 182 values.

Put another way a converted Pacer is generally regarded as a Pacer and valued as such, and with some premium over the Tri-Pacer.

A few months ago, there was a converted early 182 on the market for a looooong time. It eventually disappeared, whether sold or just gave up, I don't know. The airplane was priced at under what a comparable 180 would have sold for.

But, it's almost impossible to compare old airplanes in the marketplace. In any case, I'd be surprised if you could get the same money for a converted 182 as you could for a TOTALLY comparably equipped and condition 180.

MTV

MTV good data point. A low time early 182 with full logs and no damage is a likelier find than an equivalent 180. This may be the rationale for the 182/180 conversion. Barn find low time early 180s seem to be $100k plus these days! If any actually are left.

From some cursory, caveat not that well informed, research, I would come up with the following estimate for a 182/180 tailwheel conversion.

182 A/B airframe with 1500 hrs SMOH, around 3,000 hours and full logs, reasonable condition $40k
182/180 Tailwheel conversion, STC, labor, parts $35k
Engine overhaul/upgrade (eg P-Ponk) $40k
Cosmetics/some panel updating/contingency $40k

So around $160k -The ‘new’ 180 however would require further investment if it was to be used on floats.

Not sure how sensible the estimate is, but given the typical gotchas of any project seems a reasonable starting point?

Wings and control surfaces have been prepped, etched and alodined and are waiting their turn in the paint booth.

Keep em coming Rich!

Happy New Year!

Here are some pictures of the recent progress:
A view from below of stuff coming together.


Notice the foam that stays behind on when you try and remove the tunnel carpet. It probably brings back fond memories to many.


Looking a little better, the tunnel will ultimately also be painted gray.


Left side View



A view from below, notice the doublers/covers over the nose wheel steering rod pass through locations.


A close up of the Left side. There will still be a row of rivets just above the gear cutout. Not added yet, in case a slight modification is required to the cutout.


A view inside the paint booth.


The wings turned out very nice!

Awesome!

Looks very nice.
I always enjoy seeing in-progress pics of a metal airplane project--
there's just something about the look of the rivets & primered metal before they're painted that appeals to me.