Last month I asked the group for new interior panel recommendations. The Selkirk panels arrived Monday and I went down to the plane in the rain to see if I could get started on Wanda’s facelift.

I’m usually pretty comfortable with the dismantling phase of any project but for some reason I get squidgy every time I take even a screwdriver to my plane. I’ve done a couple projects, repairing a broken shroud under the rudder pedals and replacing a carb heat cable, but I’m uncharacteristically cautious and timid. Panel replacement is proving no different. My first thought was to remove the door and go home to replace the panel in my warm garage but it seems that would require removing the hinges from the fuselage and I don’t really want to disturb those heavily paint-encrusted screws. I decided to do the work in place.

Now I’m stuck trying to get the existing panel off. So, a few questions:
- How do I remove the door handle?
- I don’t see any screws holding the panel in place, is it self-clamped in place by edges that grip onto the door frame?
- There are a couple screws holding the armrest in place, are they screwed into the door frame or just the panel?
- If the arm rest is screwed into the door frame, what is the easiest way to measure where to drill corresponding holes in my new panel?
- How many screws should I use to hold the new panel in place? One in each corner doesn’t seem like enough but I’m not wild about drilling a bunch of holes in old Wanda if I don’t have to. Should I use some sort of sealant/caulk around the edges?

albravo wrote:So, a few questions:
- How do I remove the door handle?
- I don’t see any screws holding the panel in place, is it self-clamped in place by edges that grip onto the door frame?
- There are a couple screws holding the armrest in place, are they screwed into the door frame or just the panel?
- If the arm rest is screwed into the door frame, what is the easiest way to measure where to drill corresponding holes in my new panel?
- How many screws should I use to hold the new panel in place? One in each corner doesn’t seem like enough but I’m not wild about drilling a bunch of holes in old Wanda if I don’t have to. Should I use some sort of sealant/caulk around the edges?
]

The door handle is secured like old car handles. Just take a small hook and grab the clip (behind the lip of the handle.) Pull and it will (usually fly) off

The panel should be held with plastic clips that are pushed into holes in the door. Put a rubber knife in behind and pry up. THey will pop off.

The arm rest is fastened with two screws. They are angled up and outboard. you can use a hole finder to pick up the holes. YOu can also put some paint, ink, grease (anthying really) on the door, then place the panel where it is going to live and press. The paint will transfer to the back of the panel and should give you a good landmark.

Not sure how many screws for Selkirk. As few as possible and as many as necessary. Use small PKs with countersink washers. Start with #4's as you can always go bigger. And no caulk. Even around the edges... (general rule of thumb)

Anyway, not worry about wrenching on your bird. No biggie! Keep the pics coming!

I’m with Greg, just dive in and have fun. Aircraft interior guys always seem to fall into a grey area, I have yet to meet one with an A&P license!

You can always grind off those stock hinge pins and use the Attlee Dodge ones, makes it real easy to remove the doors for maintenance, loading, etc...

Thanks guys, that will get me into the thick of it.

I"m not sure where I'll find PK screws locally but I can always drive a couple hours to my mechanic's shop and steal some from him.

Halestorm, those are the pins I was hoping to find on the plane already. The 172 I trained in had those and they are great.

I heard from a friend of a friend, that you can order those PK screws on this thing called the "internet". Apparently there are other things to buy there as well. They will show up at your house in like a day or two. Fricken crazy world we live in.

Does anyone else think that $31.00 for a length of stainless rod bent into a loop is a bit much?

Bagarre wrote:Does anyone else think that $31.00 for a length of stainless rod bent into a loop is a bit much?

It's probably the cheapest thing you'll get away with on your bird!

For an interior panel I would just visit the local NAPA and get some nice stainless steel automotive interior screws that also come with the nice dimpled washer. NAPA usually has a huge display of all sizes. That's what most interior shops use. I would not be driving 4 hrs for a few screws of a certain brand. Honestly interior is pretty simple, take your time, measure three times, cut once. I agree to take the door off and get the Dodge quick pull pins. In the mean time you can just install the door with cotter pins until you get the correct ones. Much easier and you will get a better job working with the door on sawhorses, rather than working vertically in the rain.

Order the door hinge pins, and in meantime, find a welding rod without flux of appropriate diameter. Put a proper length of that in a vise and bent it 90 degrees. Insert that into hinge.

There is a special tool for removing those door handles. If I recall, it’s kind of a flat fork, that slides over the shaft under the handle, and compresses the catches to release the handle. You should be able to push the existing upholstery back some to visualize how it works.

I too would pull that door and work inside.

MTV

Youll want to be able to pull that door off anyways,
for loading long or bulky cargo (like a propeller).

So, in the span of one day I've gone from being afraid of unscrewing a panel to taking a grinder to my plane. This is indeed a great site!

I will throw down the cash for the Atlee Dodge pins. If only I could figure out a way of buying them and having them delivered to my house;-)

I'll use the pin that I grind down to hold the door in place in the meantime.

Tough call today, I'm stoked to begin my journey on the interior but it snowed about 16 inches last night and I have a new sled sitting on the back of my truck calling my name. Truly a quality dilemma.

albravo wrote:So, in the span of one day I've gone from being afraid of unscrewing a panel to taking a grinder to my plane. This is indeed a great site!

I will throw down the cash for the Atlee Dodge pins. If only I could figure out a way of buying them and having them delivered to my house;-)

I'll use the pin that I grind down to hold the door in place in the meantime.

Tough call today, I'm stoked to begin my journey on the interior but it snowed about 16 inches last night and I have a new sled sitting on the back of my truck calling my name. Truly a quality dilemma.

Hope it's an Arctic Cat...
Make sure you specify postal service for shipping for the hinge pins, or shipping will cost more then the price of the pins. Shipping from Alaska to Canada is borderline rape...

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I would go with MTV welding rod suggestion, actually I have before. 1/8 in stainless steel welding rod for tig welding (no flux) works good, though some Cessna's use a smaller size pin. I you are clever enough to do the interior you are clever enough to make the pins. Should save $60 plus shipping. I actually put the loop on the end just did not weld it back to itself, makes it easier to pull the pin out without tools.

Tim

A1Skinner wrote: Hope it's an Arctic Cat...

Nah, there is only one sled in the mountains around here. And it isn't Polaris either.

Turns out I have the Atlee Dodge pins on the co-pilot side. I was about to take the door off when friend called to say the sledding was really not to be missed.

Unfortunately, it won't be a grinder that removes the pilot's side hinge pin. It is slightly recessed and I'd have to grind off a bunch of hinge as well so it looks like I'll have to punch it and drill it.

I ordered a 2400 piece set of screws, washers, nuts and bolts from Aircraft Spruce. I figure if I use 400 screws per panel I should be just about right;-)

Regarding hinge pins. You can also order clevis pins from Genuine Aircraft Hardware. They're available in various lengths and diameters. Crossdrilled for a cotter pin so they don't work their way up and out. Watch the ambulance pins on the passenger side. They should be part of your walk around.

Ok, so the first door went swimmingly. The pins pulled out of the hinge cleanly and four screws hold the panel in place nicely. I just used self tapping screws from my workbench, will replace them with proper screws and washers when my Aircraftspruce order comes in.




Chuffed by my good performance on the first door, I decided to do the second door straight away. There I ran into a few new problems. The first hinge pin drilled cleanly and with a few taps with a punch the pin started to come out nicely.


Unfortunately, the second one was less slick. I drilled the top off the pin and gave it a few whacks with the punch. I thought I was making progress because I could feel the punch moving down but it seems the pin was seized and the movement I felt was the top expanding. If you look closely you'll see the top portion of the hinge has broken from the outward pressure.


Now I'm trying to minimize the expensive damage. As near as I can tell, if I really pooch that hinge the fix will be a new door. Unfortunately, I can't remove the lower hinge bracket from the airframe because the lower screw is stripped and fairly locked into place by paint.

I sprayed the hinge pin with penetrating oil and the stripped screw too. I'm thinking the best course of action tomorrow is as follows:
1. Try to remove the hinge from the airframe. If that is successful I won't have to worry about working around the strut and I can figure out how to remove the hinge pin without the proximity of the strut or the airframe.
2. If I can't remove the hinge I can try and drill out the pin that is seized. This is tricky because it is hard to get the angle right but I have a 12" 1/8" drill bit that might get pretty close to the right angle.

If I can get this apart without any futher damage, can I get the broken bit at the top of the hinge repaired? Seems like a pretty tiny piece to weld.

Any thoughts or ideas appreciated.

There’s a hole on the bottom of the door post inside the plane. That hole gives you access to the two nuts that those screws go in to. I would try getting in there with a deep socket and a screw driver on the outside. The screw looks slightly stripped but I bet it will hold on enough to get the nut off from the inside. As far as the hinge goes... I bet you’re going to have to get a new one for the portion that is attached to the door. Look in the parts manual and get the part number. There’s a lot of stuff like that for sale on eBay or from a salvage yard. You can find free PDFs of the parts manual online here: https://freeaircraftmanuals.wordpress.com/cessna/

X2 what Rob said. Just because the hinge is wrecked does not mean a new door is needed. Just replace the hinge.

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Thanks guys. Very helpful comments.

Back at it in the morning.

Don't even think about buying a whole new (really new) hinge. It's $600 from Cessna. When my IA discovered that my upper one on the pilot side was cracked, it was a matter of getting a good one off a wreck from Beegles, which is literally right next door to me, and it was practically a give-away. They are not repairable, legally, although I suspect a good welder could do a passable job.

When I bought my airplane, it had clevis pins for hinge pins, and they were like Ace sells--totally illegal, according to my IA. He replaced them with standard hinge pins. He recommended against the Atlee-Dodge types, because (he said) they tend to ride up and can come out at inopportune times--he's aware of more than one door that took leave of the airplane when that happened, doing tail feather damage in the process. So his advice was that unless I needed to remove a door, just stick with standard pins. As it happens, I've never needed to remove a door in the 14 years I've had my airplane.

When my IA installed the Door Stewards on my airplane, he removed the OEM door stops, so if I need to, I can open the door to the strut. If I were wanting to carry something really long and narrow, like skis, I suspect opening the door and opening the window would allow me to put it/them in fairly easily.

All that FWIW.

Cary